Poll States More People Think Islam Is Liberating For Women Posted: 10-18-07 15:58pm
Poll states more people think Islam is
LIBERATING for women than OPPRESSING.
Please click on the link and take this
poll, because some nuts out there have
skewed it so that the "liberating" answer
was leading earlier:
Are Islamic codes
of conduct for women more liberating or
more oppressive?
Islam is generally oppressive to women,
treating them as being less than equal to
men.
Islam is generally liberating to women,
freeing them from sexual pressures that
exist elsewhere.
Islam is generally neutral - there are
both oppressive and liberating aspects
that, in the end, cancel out.
I don't know.
I don't care
|
Rodge
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Feb 2006 Posts: 905 Location: , England, UK
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 10-18-07 16:28pm
Uh... okay. Personally, I'd prefer to be
able to wear whatever I wanted without
society enforcing sexual pressure.
But whatever, you guys. Just stay away
from me.
My mother had a traditionalist Muslim guy
spit on her once, because she was wearing
shorts and a T-shirt in the supermarket.
person.
|
Georgia59
Moderator
Joined: 11 Apr 2007 Posts: 5557 Location: Along the Mississippi, USA
Thanks: 90
Thanked:32
Posted: 10-18-07 17:05pm
But we are suppressed in the same way-
women in America (or the UK) are expected
to dress, well, normally. We are expected
to look nice and not wear anything crazy.
I have heard the argument that the
pressures to dress a certain way in
Islamic culture is freeing, and I buy it.
I think though, that it doesn't matter
what we think. It only really matters what
they think, because culture is relative.
When actual Islamic women start calling
out to stop and for help from us to help
them stop, we can go help. But it seems
that they are ok with it for now.
|
Tylanas
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 12985
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0
Posted: 10-18-07 17:43pm
If it was a CHOICE to wear the burka then
I wouldn't care. I think it is just as bad
to make it illegal to wear the burka as it
is to force it.
Also, if ALL THE OTHER oppressive factors
of the religion were gone then again it
wouldn't matter.
|
Verizon-y
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 29 Aug 2007 Posts: 3291
Thanks: 2
Thanked:0
Posted: 10-18-07 17:45pm
Georgia59
wrote:
But we are suppressed in the
same way-
women in America (or the UK) are expected
to dress, well, normally. We are expected
to look nice and not wear anything crazy.
I have heard the argument that the
pressures to dress a certain way in
Islamic culture is freeing, and I buy it.
I think though, that it doesn't matter
what we think. It only really matters what
they think, because culture is relative.
When actual Islamic women start calling
out to stop and for help from us to help
them stop, we can go help. But it seems
that they are ok with it for
now.
OH MY GOD.
|
Rodge
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Feb 2006 Posts: 905 Location: , England, UK
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 10-18-07 17:53pm
futureshock
wrote:
OH MY GOD.
I just LOL'd in real life and I'm not even
sure why.
|
Jincks013
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 Posts: 1174 Location: ,
Thanks: 22
Thanked:9
Posted: 10-19-07 07:37am
actually Georgia has a point here.. how
many female corporate officers do you see
with a feminine look? they wear basically
mens suits or severely tailored mens suits
with a below the knee acceptable skirt.
They usually have short haircuts; like
having long hair somehow makes them
'less'.
Its only been recent that women in the
U.S. Airforce could be fighter pilots;
women are still non-combatants in
conflicts; where I work few supervisory
staff are women; even when we go out. If I
wear jeans and a nice top its 'okay' but
if I wear a mini and a low cut top I am a
tramp; womens clothes ares still dictated
by men.
|
Sandbox Party
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 7276
Posted: 10-19-07 14:18pm
Jincks013
wrote:
If I wear jeans and a nice
top its 'okay' but if I wear a mini and a
low cut top I am a tramp; womens clothes
ares still dictated by
men.
well, not really.
I think plenty of women look *trashy*. Im
not a man. I judge what other women are
wearing CONSTANTLY. its just a thing i do
in myhead when im out in public. 'Man she
looks tacky." or 'wow, i bet her back is
the most profitable part of her body'.. im
guilty of it.
SOCIETY has dictated how women AND men
should look, for hundreds of years. Its
not just men; women from every walk of
life have views on whats acceptable and
not. I personally dont think its right to
wear it *if it fits*. Age, body size,
occupation, CHILDREN need to be
considered. I wouldnt dress like a tramp
around my kids.. they dont deserve to see
that. It shows lack of respect for myself
and those around me.
|
Rodge
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Feb 2006 Posts: 905 Location: , England, UK
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 10-19-07 14:36pm
Why do you care so much? They're just
clothes. I occasionally wonder if someone
is cold, but that's about it.
I would go into the the patriarchy and
societal expectations, but I am so tired
that I wouldn't make sense. Stupid
insomnia.
|
AyaMiyaki
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 8329 Location: Floating on a cloud, United States
Thanks: 182
Thanked:14
Posted: 10-19-07 15:05pm
I think people should wear what they want,
as long as their naughtier bits are
covered. If I see someone out that's
wearing something revealing, I usually
think to myself "Wow, I wish I had the
confidence to wear that."
I feel sorry for those women.
|
Sandbox Party
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 7276
Posted: 10-19-07 20:03pm
AyaMiyaki
wrote:
I think people should wear
what they want, as long as their naughtier
bits are covered. If I see someone out
that's wearing something revealing, I
usually think to myself "Wow, I wish I had
the confidence to wear that."
I feel sorry for those women.
its not a question of self confidence..
its self respect.
like those overweight obese women who wear
spandex and belly tops.
Its just.. gross to look at. and to me it
seems demeaning.
|
AyaMiyaki
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 8329 Location: Floating on a cloud, United States
Thanks: 182
Thanked:14
Posted: 10-19-07 20:20pm
So don't look at them. Obviously they like
the way they look, and as long as they're
not flashing anything pornographic they
don't have an obligation to dress the way
you
would like them to.
I think self-respect and self-confidence
go hand in hand, personally.
|
Sandbox Party
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 7276
Posted: 10-19-07 20:38pm
AyaMiyaki
wrote:
So don't look at them.
Obviously they like the way they look, and
as long as they're not flashing anything
pornographic they don't have an obligation
to dress the way you would like them to.
I think self-respect and self-confidence
go hand in hand,
personally.
yes, they do go hand in hand.
to a point.
however.. society has deemed walking
around in a g-string and halter top with
steletto's and fishnet stockings with
holes in them as inappropriate.
If you own a business and were looking for
perspective employees, and a woman walked
in smelling to high heaven and looked like
she got dressed out of a dumptster, would
you even consider her as an employee? I
wouldnt. Its not discrimination.. its
common sense. That person would represent
your business, and thats not a message you
want to get across.
I dont agree with making women wear
clothing covering their entire body.. but
i understand why they do it. If you look
at it the correct way, its all out of
respect for their wives and they dont want
other men looking at them in a sexual
manner. Im sure there are a lot of men out
there in the USA or UK that would want
their wives to do the same to keep other
male eyes off of her.
|
AyaMiyaki
Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 8329 Location: Floating on a cloud, United States
Thanks: 182
Thanked:14
Posted: 10-19-07 20:46pm
You can get arrested for wearing a
g-string in public - indecent exposure.
You can't get arrested for wearing a tube
top if you're overweight.
And quite a few things are deemed
inappropriate by "society" - homosexuals
walking down the street holding hands, for
instance. Should they feel ashamed of
themselves because somebody else doesn't
like what they see? No.
And unless the overweight tube-top wearing
woman was applying for a job, I don't see
a problem with her wearing what she likes.
No one says you have to like it - but your
opinion is yours, and should not dictate
what other people are required to do.
If my husband were to tell me to cover up
to keep other men from looking at me, I'd
laugh in his face. He doesn't own me. I'm
not his property. And if other men want to
take a peek, they're free to do so. That's
as close to me as they're ever going to
get. My husband trusts me and knows that
I'm loyal. It's good enough for him. In
fact, it's an ego boost to him when we go
out and someone checks me out. He says to
himself "That's right, she's with me."
|
Jincks013
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 Posts: 1174 Location: ,
Thanks: 22
Thanked:9
Posted: 10-20-07 07:08am
I have a very high self esteem and I wear
'trashy' clothes sometimes; I wear
everything from jeans and tee's to leather
mini's and corsets. What I wear is no ones
business but my own.
ITs not about 'self respect' its about
someone else thinking they have the right
to define my wardrobe for me. Again.. its
all about control.
|
Birch
Moderator
Joined: 07 Nov 2005 Posts: 4037 Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 141
Thanked:13
Posted: 10-20-07 10:57am
Georgia59
wrote:
But we are suppressed in the
same way-
women in America (or the UK) are expected
to dress, well, normally. We are expected
to look nice and not wear anything crazy.
I have heard the argument that the
pressures to dress a certain way in
Islamic culture is freeing, and I buy it.
I think though, that it doesn't matter
what we think. It only really matters what
they think, because culture is relative.
When actual Islamic women start calling
out to stop and for help from us to help
them stop, we can go help. But it seems
that they are ok with it for
now.
I agree Georgia.
Women are supposed to look like men in a
professional setting.
While not as extreme as requiring a burka
and all that women's sin b.s. it is
foolish to think that women in the US n' A
are 'free' to dress as they will.
|
marvel
Supporter
Joined: 09 Sep 2007 Posts: 1104 Location: Toronto, Ontario (but only a private message away)
Thanks: 50
Thanked:8
Re: Poll States More People Think Islam Is Liberating For Wo Posted: 10-22-07 07:07am
futureshock
wrote:
Poll states more people
think Islam is LIBERATING for women than
OPPRESSING.
Please click on the link and take this
poll, because some nuts out there have
skewed it so that the "liberating" answer
was leading earlier:
Are Islamic codes
of conduct for women more liberating or
more oppressive?
Islam is generally oppressive to women,
treating them as being less than equal to
men.
Islam is generally liberating to women,
freeing them from sexual pressures that
exist elsewhere.
Islam is generally neutral - there are
both oppressive and liberating aspects
that, in the end, cancel out.
I don't know.
I don't care
I bet many Muslim women answered this
survey. There's a huge wave in Islam right
now, promoting its liberating factor with
women.
I personally don't think covering up in a
burqa is necessarily liberating. HOWEVER,
since many educated, well informed Muslim
women still do it and firmly believe they
are liberated... who am I to disagree?
(The reason why I say educated and well
informed is because it's easy to say "I'm
liberated" when you're programmed to say
it... ie: not well informed and educated)
|
Georgia59
Moderator
Joined: 11 Apr 2007 Posts: 5557 Location: Along the Mississippi, USA
Thanks: 90
Thanked:32
Posted: 10-22-07 13:01pm
I've spoken with Muslim women who have
told me they like wearing the burka (and
still do here in the us) because it means
something to them. To some of them, it
doesn't represent oppression, it
represents liberation and humility. If
they want to do that, that's fine. And
unless Muslim women start saying "I am
oppressed, help me!!" we have no right to
judge their culture. The Muslim culture is
really vibrant where i live, and I know a
lot of women who wear it because they want
to. Who am I to tell them, "Oh, you are so
oppressed, you're culture is so awful, let
me dress you the way I want to dress
you......"
|
Georgia59
Moderator
Joined: 11 Apr 2007 Posts: 5557 Location: Along the Mississippi, USA
Thanks: 90
Thanked:32
Posted: 10-22-07 13:07pm
Let me begin this by saying that I am not
referring to anyone in this forum...
I HATE bleeding hearts who get on a cause
before they learn anything about it and
fight for something they know nothing
about. That's so, "I saw it on
Oprah-esque."