Should doctors stop using methotrexate in terminations?
yes they should stop
62%
[ 5 ]
no they should,nt
37%
[ 3 ]
Total Votes : 8
Author
Message
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:10pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
you insist????? Lmao
i'm sorry your "psychiatric" practice is
so slow that you have time to go through
old posts and quote them , but as I have a
life I don't.
here is some good advice
for you then. If you are not ready to
substantiate an acusation, then don't make
it. Now, I am still waiting for your
retraction of your slander.
|
lil_blaze2004
Supporter
Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 6492 Location: ,
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 01-27-05 16:13pm
steen
wrote:
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
steen
wrote:
fishx
wrote:
where is this contradicting
evidence then
steen?
i already provided you
with the evidence against your false claim
of mtx being dangerous to women. I
also provided the evidence against jlee's
lies about abortion causing breast cancer.
And I (and many others) also provided
the evidence against the lies about the
fetus feeling pain in 1st or 2nd
trimester. These pieces of evidence
are in the treads that discussed those
issues.
okay how many doing it
times are you gonna bring up the bloody
breast cancer thing...
because it is evidence of
prolife propensity to lie incessantly
until the evidence simply is so
overwhelming that even they know that they
look bad for repeating the lie.
Quote:
jlee admited she
was wrong and had posted before knowing
all the facts....
ah, but it is not that
simple. Jlee repeated her lie for many
weeks after having been given the unbiased
information from the american cancer
society. As such, she spend many weeks
deliberately lying.
Quote:
fish provided
links to mtx being deadly in women or I
guess that cnn article was all a
lie.
and I provided the
evidence to the contrary, scientific,
unbiased evidence. Yet, fishx continues
to claim his lie. And whatever ccn
said, it did not show that women were
harmed by mtx abortions. I am still
waiting for the actual evidence of this,
and will be waiting for a long time
because it doesn't exist.
Quote:
and according to
some doctors the fetus .D.O.E.S. Feel
pain in the second
trimester....
and according to some
doctors, abortion still is claimed to
cause breast cancer. That is why
medical professionals rely on
peer-reviewed science rather than people
with political agendas. Yes, the
research is unequivocally clear and I and
others have provided the links and
references for this clear evidence that it
is physically impossible for the fetus to
feel *anything at all* until the start of
3rd trimester.
Yet, fishx repeats now disproved claim.
Yet jlee took weeks before finally
halfheartedly giving up her lie about
abortion and breast cancer (and notably,
many prolife lie-sites *still* claim that
abortion causes breast cancer
yet you are still trying to lend credence
to the claim of 2nd trimester pain, and
many prolife lie-sites as well as many
other prolife posters here still repeats
those claims.
Can you guess what my conclusion about
prolifers and honesty then is?
Yes, debate is just fine. Endlessly
having to post the same evidence against
the same prolife lies is *not*
fine
here we go another "break down" post.
Once again fishx is a woman!!!!!
Secondly it seems to me you are the one
who repeats themselves endlessly. As for
2nd tri pain-reflex is the sam eto me and
we know the "fetus" has reflex's. By the
way do you remember being in you mother's
stomach???? Do you have personal proof
that we did not feel pain???? Oh and can
you gues what my opinion on steen and
honesty is???? I;m not the one going
around telling people i'm a doc.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:14pm
foreverblue
wrote:
steen
wrote:
.....But I will make it easy
for you. Just say where I lied:
.....(2) did I lie when I showed that
there was no evidence for mtx abortions
being lifethreatening to women by
referencing journal articles and the
negative searches of all medical
scientific journals? Was that just my
word? Was I lying when I provided the
reference to that
evidence?
in this thread itself are
women dying to terminate you posted two
links both to ehealth forum<which do
not work
surprise>
sorry if they didn't
work. They lkinked to two previous posts
in that same tread where I provided the
evidence.
Quote:
other than that
nothing so there you go liar,they were
probably links to your own posts which
isnt evidence
anyway
ah, but those two posts
contained the referenced evidence for my
position and the demonstration of where
fishx was wrong. And yes, of course the
links were to two of my previous posts.
I already stated that they were, as they
were links to where I had stated the
evidence. So are you dishonest or
illiterate?
|
lil_blaze2004
Supporter
Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 6492 Location: ,
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 01-27-05 16:15pm
steen
wrote:
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
you insist????? Lmao
i'm sorry your "psychiatric" practice is
so slow that you have time to go through
old posts and quote them , but as I have a
life I don't.
here is some good advice
for you then. If you are not ready to
substantiate an acusation, then don't make
it. Now, I am still waiting for your
retraction of your
slander.
it's not slander person. Do I have your
real name???? Have I made a public
announcement about you??? And once again
I do not retract when I believe in
something and I believe you are an
instigator!!!! Get over it!!!!!!
|
lil_blaze2004
Supporter
Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 6492 Location: ,
Thanks: 1
Thanked:0
Posted: 01-27-05 16:17pm
steen
wrote:
so are you dishonest or
illiterate?
are you a person or an problem???? Or a
16yrold boy????? Hmmmm...
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:17pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
and don't tell me I have no
integrity..
you are the one who makes
flase claims that you can't back up but
refuse to retract. You are the one with
the lie that you can't justify with
evidence.
If you actually *had* integrity, you would
retract or prove. I am waiting.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:18pm
fishx
wrote:
and will you retract all
your lies then
steen
oh? Where did I lie?
Please document your claim.
|
FISHX
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 27 Dec 2004 Posts: 920 Location: UK
Posted: 01-27-05 16:21pm
steen
wrote:
fishx
wrote:
and will you retract all
your lies then
steen
oh? Where did I lie?
Please document your
claim.
there are so many where do I start well
theres the i,m a doctor for one , oh and
methotrexate is,nt used in firts trimester
terminations and theres medline do,nt use
merriam websters do you really want me to
go on ? Have you told that many lies that
you ca,nt remember them ?
|
foreverblue
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 577
Posted: 01-27-05 16:21pm
steen
wrote:
foreverblue
wrote:
steen
wrote:
.....But I will make it easy
for you. Just say where I lied:
.....(2) did I lie when I showed that
there was no evidence for mtx abortions
being lifethreatening to women by
referencing journal articles and the
negative searches of all medical
scientific journals? Was that just my
word? Was I lying when I provided the
reference to that
evidence?
in this thread itself are
women dying to terminate you posted two
links both to ehealth forum<which do
not work
surprise>
sorry if they didn't
work. They lkinked to two previous
posts in that same tread where I provided
the evidence.
Quote:
other than that
nothing so there you go liar,they were
probably links to your own posts which
isnt evidence
anyway
ah, but those two posts
contained the referenced evidence for my
position and the demonstration of where
fishx was wrong. And yes, of course the
links were to two of my previous posts.
I already stated that they were, as they
were links to where I had stated the
evidence. So are you dishonest or
illiterate?
this from the man who cannot spell and you
call me illiterate hahaha
there are no links other than the two
ehealth forum on this thread,posted by you
so what evidence do they point to,your
word,and no you did not state they pointed
to your posts liar,this is almost to easy
proving you a liar.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:28pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
whatever steen, you know
what you did.
yes, which is why I am
now challenging you on your false claim
about me.
Quote:
when I first came
on anything I said you said I was lying...
again, if you are going
to make such accusations, document your
claim or retract. You are falsely
maligning me. So we are back to that
integrity issue.
Quote:
if we call our
"fetus' " babies then that is our
choice--does not make us a
liar.
correct. I have not
stated that using "baby" was a lie. I
have stated that is is a misrepresentation
of properly defined developmental stages
and so on.
Quote:
if my doc tells
me that a 20week old "fetus" feels pain
and I post it, then I believe my real doc
over you, yet you say it's a
lie..
when I post the actual,
scientific evidence to the contrary,
evidence that your doctor should have read
before making such a claim, then your
doctor was wrong (probably lazy by not
bothering to look up something before
claiming something factual). And yes,
when the evidence directly contradicts
your doctor, then your repeating the
doctor's claim is the repetition of an
already disproved falsehood.
Quote:
you break down
everyone's posts and attack them untill
people get so fed up they start calling
you names...
i couldn't care less what
I am called as long as I am not lied
about.
Quote:
and I won't
retract something I believe
in.
ah, so it is only your
"belief" that I have attacked people right
off? That still is a claim to a factual
event, and still is false. So it really
doesn't help you. You are still making a
false claim about me, and you still aren't
showing enough integrity to retract your
false accusation.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:28pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
whatever steen, you know
what you did.
yes, which is why I am
now challenging you on your false claim
about me.
Quote:
when I first came
on anything I said you said I was lying...
again, if you are going
to make such accusations, document your
claim or retract. You are falsely
maligning me. So we are back to that
integrity issue.
Quote:
if we call our
"fetus' " babies then that is our
choice--does not make us a
liar.
correct. I have not
stated that using "baby" was a lie. I
have stated that is is a misrepresentation
of properly defined developmental stages
and so on.
Quote:
if my doc tells
me that a 20week old "fetus" feels pain
and I post it, then I believe my real doc
over you, yet you say it's a
lie..
when I post the actual,
scientific evidence to the contrary,
evidence that your doctor should have read
before making such a claim, then your
doctor was wrong (probably lazy by not
bothering to look up something before
claiming something factual). And yes,
when the evidence directly contradicts
your doctor, then your repeating the
doctor's claim is the repetition of an
already disproved falsehood.
Quote:
you break down
everyone's posts and attack them untill
people get so fed up they start calling
you names...
i couldn't care less what
I am called as long as I am not lied
about.
Quote:
and I won't
retract something I believe
in.
ah, so it is only your
"belief" that I have attacked people right
off? That still is a claim to a factual
event, and still is false. So it really
doesn't help you. You are still making a
false claim about me, and you still aren't
showing enough integrity to retract your
false accusation.
|
foreverblue
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 577
Posted: 01-27-05 16:31pm
Definition of racism
discriminatory or abusive behavior towards
members of another race
there you go steen,the comment you
made,no matter how much you try to claim
it has fact,was discriminatory and abusive
towards the british.So now I have proved
you a liar and a racist.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:31pm
foreverblue
wrote:
i agree lil I tried to be
civil but when he couldnt find a reason he
took one line and twisted
it
i already showed your
post where you tried to make a
differentiation based on the risk of an
occurance, a thing you denied to have
done. If you object to that, go to the
post in question and prove yourself.
Your claim now that I twisted anything is
a false accusation. And no, that is not
a "civil" thing to do. I can be real
civil in discussing facts. But don't
make false accusations about me.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:33pm
fishx
wrote:
steen
wrote:
{about mtx}
fishx
wrote:
your links did,nt work
please suply this evidence
.
i proviided the medical
reference to a scientific journal article
you can obtain through interlibrary loan
if you do not have access to medline so
your claim about a link that didn't work
is an outright lie as I didn't give an
online link to that issue. Nice going
there, the links were to posts earlier in
the tread, posts you had
answered.
then do what you demand
of others post your
proof
i did, liar. It is in
those posts, posts that you already saw
because you answered them.
Why does prolifers always lie so much
<turning my eyes towards heaven>?
|
foreverblue
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 577
Posted: 01-27-05 16:34pm
steen
wrote:
foreverblue
wrote:
i agree lil I tried to be
civil but when he couldnt find a reason he
took one line and twisted
it
i already showed your
post where you tried to make a
differentiation based on the risk of an
occurance, a thing you denied to have
done. If you object to that, go to the
post in question and prove yourself.
Your claim now that I twisted anything is
a false accusation. And no, that is not
a "civil" thing to do. I can be real
civil in discussing facts. But don't
make false accusations about
me.
I all ready have you fool how many more
times do you need tellin you lying racist
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:41pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
here we go another "break
down" post. Once again fishx is a
woman!!!!! Secondly it seems to me you
are the one who repeats themselves
endlessly.
funny how you seem to not
have addressed the point in the post, the
one about how prolife lies are documented,
yet repeated. Is that to embarrassing
for you? Or are you just fine with lies
as long as they are prolife lies?
Quote:
as for 2nd tri
pain-reflex is the sam eto
me
yes, I have no doubt that
you do not differentiate between a
sensation and a reflex. But given that
*in reality* there is a huge difference as
the two don't overlap (sensations are not
reflexes and reflexes do not involve any
sensation), such a lack of distinction
merely fosters your own ignorance and
makes you sound like you don't know what
you are talking about.
Quote:
and we know the
"fetus" has
reflex's.
reflexes that don't
involves feeling or cognitively sensing
anything. As such, talking about "pain"
when talking about reflexes is initially
ignorant. And after awareness that
reflexes don't involve sensation, then
such repeated claims would involve
outright dishonesty.
Quote:
by the way do you
remember being in you mother's
stomach????
nope.
Quote:
do you have
personal proof that we did not feel
pain????
no, and neither does
anybody have any personal evidence that we
did. As such, we rely on the actual
evidence there is, and that evidence, as
has been reposted here several times is
clear that there is no physical ability to
feel anything (including pain) until 3rd
trimester because the parts of the brain
necessary for such processing are not even
connected until then.
And yes, I have no doubt that this same
information will be reposted here many
times, as prolifers will repeat that
falsehood never mind how many times the
facts have been documented before that.
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:44pm
lil_blaze2004
wrote:
it's not slander person.
Do I have your real name???? Have I
made a public announcement about
you???
in this forum, where my
posts are associated with my name, yes you
have. And that has actually been found
legally binmding in court. So your claim
is false.
Quote:
and once again I
do not retract when I believe in something
and I believe you are an instigator!!!!
Get over
it!!!!!!
you can believe that all
you want. That is not what I want
retracted. I want you to retract your
outright false claim about me. I
couldn't care less about your opinion;
but I do care about your flase claim about
me. A claim that you now are refusing to
retract. Yes, the dishonesty yet again
shows the poor integrity of prolifers.
|
foreverblue
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 577
Posted: 01-27-05 16:46pm
steen
wrote:
fishx
wrote:
steen
wrote:
{about mtx}
fishx
wrote:
your links did,nt work
please suply this evidence
.
i proviided the medical
reference to a scientific journal article
you can obtain through interlibrary loan
if you do not have access to medline so
your claim about a link that didn't work
is an outright lie as I didn't give an
online link to that issue. Nice
going there, the links were to posts
earlier in the tread, posts you had
answered.
then do what you demand
of others post your
proof
i did, liar. It is in
those posts, posts that you already saw
because you answered them.
Why does prolifers always lie so much
<turning my eyes towards
heaven>?
you wrote words for all we know you could
of made it up there was no links to prove
your evidence,mr hypocrite,racist liar.
|
foreverblue
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 577
Posted: 01-27-05 16:51pm
Steen are you really as stupid as you are
making yourself out to be,or do you
deserve an oscar.The problem with you is
it appears that you suffer from severe
memory loss,as everything I say about you
can be proven, and we can all read what
you have or havent posted steen
|
steen
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 1797 Location: Upper Midwest
Posted: 01-27-05 16:52pm
fishx
wrote:
steen
wrote:
fishx
wrote:
and will you retract all
your lies then
steen
oh? Where did I lie?
Please document your
claim.
there are so many where
do I start well theres the i,m a doctor
for one ,
i never actually stated
that (i am, but as there is no specific
way to document that online without having
some prolife fanatic show up with a bomb,
I have no intention of doing so). But
neither, because of same, are you able to
prove that I am not, and as such you can
not prove a lie. So where did I lie?
Quote:
oh and
methotrexate is,nt used in firts trimester
terminations
actually, I was asking
you for evidence that it was. That's not
the same thing. You specifically made
claims about women being harmed by mtx
(the abbreviation is easier to use, feel
free to do so, it is medically recognized)
and I asked for your evidence, evidence
that so far has not showed women harmed or
even at risk from such speculated 1st
trimester mtx abortions. Now, mtx *is*
used in 1st trimester ectopic pregnancies
where it is impossible to get to the
embryo in the usual ways, and no there
hasn't ben recorded deaths of women from
mtx use there as well. So exactly what
is now left of your claim and where did I
lie?
Quote:
and theres
medline do,nt use merriam
websters
ah, but the issue was
what medline uses for its medical
definitions, not what search tool they use
online. And no, the definitions are
based on stedman's medical dictionary.
So where was the lie?
Quote:
do you really
want me to go on
?
actually you need to,
because as I just showed, I have not lied
in any of the 3 examples you provided.
So I am still awaiting your evidence of my
lies.
Quote:
have you told
that many lies that you ca,nt remember
them ?
