Abortion Debate Forum - What Am I ?????????????? page 2


What Am I ??????????????

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steen

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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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Location: Upper Midwest

Posted: 02-03-05 14:37pm

foreverblue wrote:

steen wrote:

hmm, and I believe it is the woman's right to decide whether she has an abortion or not, and I am opposed to the death penalty. Guess that makes me a pro-lifchoicer, then

are you joining the new movement then steen and become a pro-cholifer

actually, I am a pro-lifchoicers instead. Kind of the opposite of you. Against death penalty, for the woman's right to chose an abortion

foreverblue

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Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 577

Posted: 02-04-05 07:34am

steen wrote:

foreverblue wrote:

steen wrote:

hmm, and I believe it is the woman's right to decide whether she has an abortion or not, and I am opposed to the death penalty. Guess that makes me a pro-lifchoicer, then

are you joining the new movement then steen and become a pro-cholifer

actually, I am a pro-lifchoicers instead. Kind of the opposite of you. Against death penalty, for the woman's right to chose an abortion

i have no thoughts on the death penalty,because we do not have it in this country.If it was in force here then I really do not know where I would stand on the issue,i do know of a few cases where it has been proven to be a misscarriage of justice,not much help to the poor person who as died though is it?

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
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Location: UK

Posted: 02-04-05 09:05am

jlee77 wrote:

i am totally for the death penalty. I don't care about "justice" for the person that received the penalty cause as far as i'm concerned, he has no rights. It's like feeling bad for scott peterson...Umm, not going to happen.

On america's most wanted the other day they had a nurse and her husband who were raping a parapalegic, etc.....(basically a vegetable) little girl in their care. They received 2 life sentences. While I do favor the death penalty, I actually favor the life sentences over it because the "chair" or what have you...Is an "easy" way out. Let them rot in jail and child abusers/molesters typically are mur,dered in prison anyhow. It's not "looked upon" too nicely. Not even by the lowest of scum prisoners. They will have fun behind bars i'm sure. I do feel however it may be, they should rot in hell for the rest of eternity. Sick, sick sick.

totaly 100% agreed peadophiles should rot in a hell of there own making.

bd1012

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Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 1998

Posted: 02-04-05 09:49am

jlee77 wrote:

but I thought "god" said "thou shall not kill"? He didn't say what or whom he was talking about. I thought that's what some of you went by. Also.. Remember that the criminal probably has innoncent family members who will grieve their death just like the victim's family members.. If the crime was homicide.

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
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Posted: 02-04-05 10:03am

bd1012 wrote:

jlee77 wrote:

bd I don,t beleive in any faith so thou shall not kill means nothing to me and while I have sympathy for both the perpetrators and the victims family I do beleive that if you take one of mine I will take one of yours sorry thats just the way I am haence the question what am i? :roll:
maybe one day I will truly know what I am and where I stand

steen

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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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Location: Upper Midwest

Posted: 02-04-05 20:00pm

foreverblue wrote:

yes, it is poor comfort to those who are killed and their families. It also is a tool of social divisiveness when it is applied predominately against minorities, as is the case in the us.

steen

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Location: Upper Midwest

Posted: 02-04-05 20:04pm

jlee77 wrote:

i am totally for the death penalty. I don't care about "justice" for the person that received the penalty cause as far as i'm concerned, he has no rights.

regardless of whether he is innocent or not? Are you into the barbaric view of the legal system and "justice" being equal to revenge?

Quote:

it's like feeling bad for scott peterson...Umm, not going to happen.

well, he is going to get off because of the creative charges and the circumstantial evidence anyway.

sandyallen

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Posted: 02-05-05 00:40am


Take a look @ charley manson, he should have been done in a long time ago and yet tax payers are still supporting that jerk(freak of nature), yuk! Always, sandy

steen

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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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Location: Upper Midwest

Posted: 02-05-05 12:39pm

jlee77 wrote:

steen wrote:

jlee77 wrote:

i am totally for the death penalty. I don't care about "justice" for the person that received the penalty cause as far as i'm concerned, he has no rights.

regardless of whether he is innocent or not? Are you into the barbaric view of the legal system and "justice" being equal to revenge?

Quote:

it's like feeling bad for scott peterson...Umm, not going to happen.

well, he is going to get off because of the creative charges and the circumstantial evidence anyway.

no...Of course I did not mean "regardless of if he is innocent or not". I thought common sense would tell you that. But since it didn't, I stand corrected: I don't believe the innocent should die. :roll:

so when you stated that when somebody has received the death penalty, they are without rights, you only mean when they are actually guilty? So the ones with the death penalty who are actually not guilty, they still have rights?

steen

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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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Posted: 02-05-05 18:51pm

jlee77 wrote:

are you trying tomake this difficult simply because **i** posted it. What exactly are you asking me?

i merely found what appears to be an inconsistency.

Quote:

if they are **not guilty** then they should not be on death row in the first place.

isn't that special, given the many reversals we have had of deathrow cases where the person later have been found to *not* be guilty. Afair, it is now more than 100 people who have been released from death row because they were found innocent.
O

Quote:

f course innocent people should have rights.

even if they are on death row? That was the inconsistency I found in yor post.

Quote:

i think everyone has the right to a fair trial because nobody on this earth knows for sure who is guilty/innocent except god. (althought sometimes it's quite obvious). This is why the right to a fair trial exists. But I have no sympathy nor mercy for convicted felons, specifically brutal not a nice persons on death row. Fry em'...They are no loss to society, except of course to their families. Those are the ones to feel bad for. And I do.

and so, when they are already on death row, regardless of their innocence, they should fry merely because we "believe" them to be innocent?

Quote:

as for scott peterson. It cannot get any clearer that he killed his child and wife.

it could actually, as he was convicted on circumstantial evidence only.

Quote:

but i'm sure you will maintain the difficult road and dispute this as well cause there will be some flaw in something right steen? Well we can agree to disagree about peterson, in my vision, he is guilty and was found guilty and will fry. Just too bad it won't be for years.

and if the real killer is found sometime after he is "fried," then what?

I find it troublesome that we can actually send somebody to their death for a homicide there were no witnesses on, no homicide weapon, no evidence even that they wer close together at the time of the homicide or anything. Sending somebody to die merely bbecause we don't like him and feel that he "probably" did it, that is very disturbing and further evidence of how barbaric the us is in its dubious application of the death penalty.

Perhaps a prosecutor wanted this conviction badly because it is perceived to further his career. But to me, such conviction is good evidence of the *flawed* character of the prosecutor and a good reason to work actively against his political and judicial aspirations.

Lukitsme03

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Joined: 08 Apr 2005
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Re: What Am I ??????????????
Posted: 04-22-05 15:50pm

fishx wrote:

i can,t be prolife because I beleive in the death penalty.

And I can,t be pro choice because though I know termination is needed by some I beleive it is only right when the woman has no choice ie:death or seriouse risk to health of woman/fetus/baby.

So what am I ?

i agree with you, thats what I believe but everyone seems to give me a hard time for it ... Maybe its because I just really say what I think idk or maybe its the way I put things?! Oh well I agree with you neways

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 920
Location: UK

Posted: 04-23-05 08:58am


Luke I think that it is because you seem so angry all the time that people are giving you such a hard time I know it is hard but try to put what other people have to say to one side and don't get side tracked by anger and you will make your point a lot stronger. I will probably get jumped all over now but here goes there are certian users on this forum that cannot argue with anyone pro life without resorting to insults and abuse now my belief is that they don't know how to debate civily and if all pro lifers keep calm then certian posters cannot handle it and get flusterd therefore not making their point and just ranting and insulting seriously try it I bet i'm right if we debate calmly we will still get insulted but we will be the bigger people and have more succsess in getting our voices heard and listened to.

Lukitsme03

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Posted: 04-24-05 02:09am


It's really hard to keep your cool and be calm really hard(for me, at times) and i'll admit im good at bein a 'bi' when I want or need to be. Although in general, and just myself, not upset, I can be a really nice and understanding person. Im gonna have to leave the abortion debate for a while and idk if i'll be comming back maybe if I can learn to keep my cool and get my point out there calmly.. But you are sooooooooooo right .Everything you said!!! And if you get jumped on its because they know you are right! Plus you seem like the type of person that could deal(calmly) with what 'those people' may say to ya. Thanks alot!! Oh and as you would understand, I am not leaving the debate because I cant deal with what they say or I dont have something to say back its just that I cant seem to keep my cool and im getting really fed up and frustrated.

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
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Posted: 04-24-05 09:27am

lukitsme03 wrote:

it's really hard to keep your cool and be calm really hard(for me, at times) and i'll admit im good at bein a 'bi' when I want or need to be. Although in general, and just myself, not upset, I can be a really nice and understanding person. Im gonna have to leave the abortion debate for a while and idk if i'll be comming back maybe if I can learn to keep my cool and get my point out there calmly.. But you are sooooooooooo right .Everything you said!!! And if you get jumped on its because they know you are right! Plus you seem like the type of person that could deal(calmly) with what 'those people' may say to ya.

Thanks alot!!

Oh and as you would understand, I am not leaving the debate because I cant deal with what they say or I dont have something to say back its just that I cant seem to keep my cool and im getting really fed up and frustrated.

i understand why you are leaving but seriously I wouldn't leave just yet I would stick around for a while and just see how you get on trying to keep your kool.
If you actualy went back over my old posts I was just like you and always posted when I was angry and just ended up making a complete fool of myself and my cause now though I read the replys in the morning then I sit and write my replies in a note book read them leave them an hour or so and then read them again you can qaurantee that I have to edit them at least twice before I am actualy calm enough to post them.

Give it a try rather than just leaving you have a lot to say and the right to say it I know you can do this calmly.

sandyallen

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Posted: 04-27-05 19:26pm


Yes fish and did you not jump down my throat a few days ago for something you misunderstood and I had to turn around and explain again to you what I said and I will give you credit, you did apologize. I would definitely say that your so called "insults" and "abuse" and "ranting" is not just from the pro-choice side I would also say it is coming from pro-lifers as well. We(pro-choice) have debated several times civil and we get jumped on as well and I will not mention names because I will not even deal with them any longer. So, please do not say it is just the pro-choise that does this as this is totally wrong and you know it is. Sincerely, sandy

bd1012

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Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 1998

Posted: 04-27-05 21:29pm

lukitsme wrote:

i cant seem to keep my cool and im getting really fed up and frustrated

gee.. Who'da thunk it eh?

steen

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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Upper Midwest

Posted: 04-27-05 22:46pm

lukitsme03 wrote:

and if you get jumped on its because they know you are right!

well, that's a novel idea. People disagree with you because they see you as being wrong. Where you got your weird interpretation of this from is not clear, but it seems illogical.

Kia

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Joined: 23 Jun 2004
Posts: 6594
Location: Planet Tampaxia,

Posted: 04-28-05 02:19am


Having been in such situations my view is abortion as birth control is wrong. However abortion in the case of rape - (no I didn't ask for it, I had my drinks spike with rohypnol when I was 18) - should be a choice also abortion in life death situations should be a choice. (prior to 8 weeks) last autumn my uterus ruptured and 18 1/2 weeks into am uch wanted pregnancy I had to have an emergency hysterectomy and what I guess for all intents and purposes would be an abortion because the baby had ruptured out of my uterus. Am I a bad person?

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
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Posted: 04-28-05 02:33am


No kia you are not a bad person the circumstances of your termination are perfectly valid and no one can say any different.

FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 920
Location: UK

Posted: 04-28-05 02:37am

sandyallen wrote:

yes fish and did you not jump down my throat a few days ago for something you misunderstood and I had to turn around and explain again to you what I said and I will give you credit, you did apologize. I would definitely say that your so called "insults" and "abuse" and "ranting" is not just from the pro-choice side I would also say it is coming from pro-lifers as well. We(pro-choice) have debated several times civil and we get jumped on as well and I will not mention names because I will not even deal with them any longer. So, please do not say it is just the pro-choise that does this as this is totally wrong and you know it is.

Sincerely,
sandy

.

No sandy I agree it is not just from the pro choice side and reading back through my post it does indeed seem that I am insinuating that it does.
I can only apologize to pro choice for that as that was not my intention.
We have just as many pro lifers that cannot get the hang of civilised debate.So apologise once again it was not my intention to vilify pro choice alone.