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Nazi Eugenics And Pro Choice Eugenics

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Izzy

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Nazi Eugenics And Pro Choice Eugenics
Posted: 02-15-05 07:54am

T-4 was a forced euthanasia program that targeted the mentally handicapped and the physically disabled and deformed. The gas chambers here became the model for the death camps. The euthanasia program was part of the larger nazi eugenics program which evolved into 'the final solution' campaign
we now call the nazi holocaust.

Now: the unborn child is often targeted for death
if tests show that it may have a physical or mental handicap.
The american eugenics program has no central sponsor
but several big guns, including planned parenthood,
naral (national abortion rights action league and the national abortion federation. British eugenics is alive and well in the nhs.Planned parenthood founder margaret sanger was a nazi sympathizer and an ardent proponent of eugenics. She was also known for her strong anti-black sentiments and geared her eugenicists efforts towards annihilating the black race in america.

The combined forces of these individuals and groups make up the 'pro-choice' campaign, a thinly veiled 'final solution' for the unwanted unborn child.



Dehumanization



then: to achieve the 'final solution of the jewish question in europe', the nazis long before had put into motion a process to 'de-humanize' the jewish people. It was argued that the jews were a sort of
'sub strata' of the human species and that these 'non-humans' could be done away with wholesale and without any moral consequence.




Now: to achieve abortion on demand, a deliberate campaign was set into motion to de-humanize the unborn child. The argument was made that the unborn child was anything but human. It was
a 'zygote', 'blob of tissue', 'fetus', 'product of conception' etc. Etc.
It was argued that these 'non-humans' could be done away with if one so chose, and without any moral consequence.






Selection

then: the nazi ss and nazi doctors chose who would live and who would die. Little children, the infirm, the old, the weak were inevitably sent to the gas. Within hours, their remains were burned in ovens or thrown into mass graves.

Now: dr's and mothers choose who will live and who will die. Within hours, their little remains will be incinerated, ground up, or disposed of by some other distasteful means.


Special action

then: the nazis used several methods of eliminating their 'non-humans': gas, torture, injection, etc.


Now: Dr. 's have perfected several methods of eliminating
these 'non-humans': dismemberment, suction, brain suction.



Resistance



then:
many untold numbers resisted hitler and the third reich's attempt to rule europe
with an iron fist and eventually conquer the world. They were among the first to fight and resist hitler's 'final solution of the jewish question in europe'.

They were viewed by hitler and the third reich as enemies of the reich, contemptible traitors
worthy of torture and death.


Now: activists resist pro-abortion group's
attempts to rule over the abortion issue with an iron fist and
eventually crush all abortion resistance.
These modern day resisters continue to be the first and
last line of defence for the unborn child.
They are viewed by all in the abortion movement and
many in our government, our courts,
our churches and large segments of the populace as
enemies of this present order, contemptible traitors
to the cause of woman's liberation,
worthy of abuse, harassment, lawsuits and arrest.



Resistance ii

then: men, women and even children resisted the nazi's in many ways. The resistance was as covert as silent prayers said in secret places and as overt as direct confrontation in the warsaw ghetto uprising and revolts in the concentration camps where the killing chambers were.

Now: men, women and even children resist the abortion machine. Their resistance is as covert as silent prayers said in secret places and as overt as direct confrontation at the
killing chambers. In cases of mid to late term abortions,former abortion clinic nurses and
former abortionists have stated that they observed the unborn child resisting the attempts of the abortionists attempts to grab hold of a leg or arm with instruments or to be poked with a needle. They have witnessed this via ultra-sound imaging.
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FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 920
Location: UK
Re: Nazi Eugenics And Pro Choice Eugenics
Posted: 02-15-05 08:38am

izzy wrote:
t-4 was a forced euthanasia program that targeted the mentally handicapped and the physically disabled and deformed. The gas chambers here became the model for the death camps. The euthanasia program was part of the larger nazi eugenics program which evolved into 'the final solution' campaign
we now call the nazi holocaust.


Now: the unborn child is often targeted for death
if tests show that it may have a physical or mental handicap.

The american eugenics program has no central sponsor
but several big guns, including planned parenthood,
naral (national abortion rights action league and the national abortion federation. British eugenics is alive and well in the nhs.Planned parenthood founder margaret sanger was a nazi sympathizer and an ardent proponent of eugenics. She was also known for her strong anti-black sentiments and geared her eugenicists efforts towards annihilating the black race in america.


The combined forces of these individuals and groups make up the 'pro-choice' campaign, a thinly veiled 'final solution' for the unwanted unborn child.




Dehumanization



then: to achieve the 'final solution of the jewish question in europe', the nazis long before had put into motion a process to 'de-humanize' the jewish people. It was argued that the jews were a sort of
'sub strata' of the human species and that these 'non-humans' could be done away with wholesale and without any moral consequence.





Now: to achieve abortion on demand, a deliberate campaign was set into motion to de-humanize the unborn child. The argument was made that the unborn child was anything but human. It was
a 'zygote', 'blob of tissue', 'fetus', 'product of conception' etc. Etc.

It was argued that these 'non-humans' could be done away with if one so chose, and without any moral consequence.






Selection

then: the nazi ss and nazi doctors chose who would live and who would die. Little children, the infirm, the old, the weak were inevitably sent to the gas. Within hours, their remains were burned in ovens or thrown into mass graves.


Now: dr's and mothers choose who will live and who will die. Within hours, their little remains will be incinerated, ground up, or disposed of by some other distasteful means.



Special action

then: the nazis used several methods of eliminating their 'non-humans': gas, torture, injection, etc.


Now: Dr. 's have perfected several methods of eliminating
these 'non-humans': dismemberment, suction, brain suction.




Resistance



then:
many untold numbers resisted hitler and the third reich's attempt to rule europe
with an iron fist and eventually conquer the world. They were among the first to fight and resist hitler's 'final solution of the jewish question in europe'.


They were viewed by hitler and the third reich as enemies of the reich, contemptible traitors
worthy of torture and death.



Now: activists resist pro-abortion group's
attempts to rule over the abortion issue with an iron fist and
eventually crush all abortion resistance.
These modern day resisters continue to be the first and
last line of defence for the unborn child.
They are viewed by all in the abortion movement and
many in our government, our courts,
our churches and large segments of the populace as
enemies of this present order, contemptible traitors
to the cause of woman's liberation,
worthy of abuse, harassment, lawsuits and arrest.




Resistance ii

then: men, women and even children resisted the nazi's in many ways. The resistance was as covert as silent prayers said in secret places and as overt as direct confrontation in the warsaw ghetto uprising and revolts in the concentration camps where the killing chambers were.

Now: men, women and even children resist the abortion machine. Their resistance is as covert as silent prayers said in secret places and as overt as direct confrontation at the
killing chambers. In cases of mid to late term abortions,former abortion clinic nurses and
former abortionists have stated that they observed the unborn child resisting the attempts of the abortionists attempts to grab hold of a leg or arm with instruments or to be poked with a needle. They have witnessed this via ultra-sound imaging.




i can see where you are coming from and what is and has happend is totaly wrong in my view anyway(this is by no means fact only my opinion)
but it is also wrong to compare it to the holocaust and nazi's.

What happend to the jews; british service men/women, and anyone else unlucky enough to have experienced the atrocities of being a prisoner of war is a disgrace to humanity not to take anything away rom the tragic conseguence of termination but they can be in no way compared to the holocaust .
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Izzy

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Joined: 16 Oct 2004
Posts: 883
Location: Earth

Posted: 02-15-05 09:12am

I have given factual reasons and historical business links as to how it can, you have expressed a feeling with no reasons why you feel that way, now I believe that is wrong, to play down the reality of abortion without reason

can you give me some reasons why as you say

"the tragic conseguence of termination" "can be in no way compared to the holocaust"

why?

Take your use of word

termination,

it reeks of a similar word used to describe the holocaust


extermination
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FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 920
Location: UK

Posted: 02-15-05 09:21am

izzy wrote:
i have given factual reasons and historical business links as to how it can, you have expressed a feeling with no reasons why you feel that way, now I believe that is wrong, to play down the reality of abortion without reason

can you give me some reasons why as you say

"the tragic conseguence of termination" "can be in no way compared to the holocaust"

why?


Take your use of word

termination,

it reeks of a similar word used to describe the holocaust


extermination





no you get me wrong I am not trying to play down termination (sorry I really can't stand the other word) all i'm trying to say is that to know you are going to be killed and physicaly await the moment has got to be ten times worse than not knowing anything untill it happens sorry conseguence is'nt the word i'm looking for but I just can't seem to get the right word. For instance for a mother to know that her husband and children are going to be killed and she can't stop it must be a living hell in itself.

The actual act of termination is no better nor no worse than extermination.
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Izzy

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Joined: 16 Oct 2004
Posts: 883
Location: Earth

Posted: 02-15-05 09:56am

So let me get this right in your opinion it is wrong to compare the eugenics of america/ westerm societies to the eugenics of nazi germany simply becuase people knew they were going to die in nazi germany, where in america the killing is done on the unexpecting individuals in the womb, who dont know its going to happen?


Your not saying the killing is right on either count, just its wrong for that reason to compare?


If that is what your saying, the fact the jews, disabled etc were going to be killed when they got to these camps and hospitals was hidden from them and the general populance. Some guessed, supposed but did not know for sure.


Even then, the evil of eugenics is not in the knowing or not knowing of ones fate but the fact it is killing people, and its not just the killing either but the fact that both the holocaust of nazi germany and the holocaust of america prevent many others from being born.


A hitler wanted to wipe out the jewish race, this would have been primeraly achieved not by killing everyone of the jews but by killing the jews it would prevent the birth of many other jews, a tidy form of birth control.

Planned parenthood was started by margaret sanger a nazi sympathiser with the puropse of wiping out america's black population adolf hitler was a great admirer of m sanger and was a argent reader of her publications.


Margaret sanger wanted to wipe out the simple minded people in society and let the inteligent or as she called them "genius'" flurish, this was one of her main reasons for her support of birth control and abortion... Who are the simple minded people?


I am not, I know what abortion is!


The simple minded are those who are easily mislead into the conclusion that abortion is a human right.


Planned parenthood still target the black and hispanic communities along with the working under-educated classes.


The nazi's used propaganda to influence peoples perspectives on their ideologies, the same use of propaganda is used throughout the media today.

The next time you use contraception or if the reader is contemplating or has had an abortion, maybe you should consider the fact the planned parenthood want to stop you from reproducing because your not inteligent/genius enough for society, you yourself are less than human to them.
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Izzy

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Joined: 16 Oct 2004
Posts: 883
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Posted: 02-15-05 10:46am

"...Abortion is a necessary evil that we must accept out of respect for life."

- Dr. Ley, nazi racial hygienist, on having "quality," "planned" children, at a meeting on june 15, 1937 with nazi ss head, heinrich himmler.

"germans can not have abortions, but jews can, since this can only benefit the german people."

-nazi government announcement through the press, 1938.
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FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 920
Location: UK

Posted: 02-15-05 10:55am

izzy wrote:
"...Abortion is a necessary evil that we must accept out of respect for life."

- Dr. Ley, nazi racial hygienist, on having "quality," "planned" children, at a meeting on june 15, 1937 with nazi ss head, heinrich himmler.


"germans can not have abortions, but jews can, since this can only benefit the german people."

-nazi government announcement through the press, 1938.




then aren't we lucky that hitler commited suicide I really could not live under a nazi regime they have no morals .
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:08am

Is that tongue in cheek?

It seem's as though it is, becuase how many times do you hear words similar or to the effect of the following

abortion is a necessary right that must accept out of respect for the lifestyle of the mother

or

"abortion is a necessary right that must accept out of respect for the quality of life of the baby"


now compare to the nazi doctor.

"abortion is a necessary evil that we must accept out of respect for life"



*eerie... Shivers up spine*
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FISHX

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Joined: 27 Dec 2004
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Posted: 02-15-05 11:15am

No I was seriouse when I said i'm glad hitler commited suicide.

I hear them sentences to many times once is to many times.
The mothers lifestyle should be neither here or there the mothers lifestyle should not feature in termination.
How can people be 100% sure what the babies life would be like before birth.


How can respect for life and termination be honestly used in the same line?
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:21am

I think what the doc was saying is

abortion is required to irradicate those whom the nazis had determined undesirabe who could infect life with their impure genes, hence ayrian people were not allowed to abort and others were sometimes even required to abort


Last edited by Izzy on 02-15-05 11:28am; edited 3 times in total
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FISHX

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:26am

izzy wrote:
i think what the doc was saying is

abortion is required to irradicate those whom the nazis had determined undesirabe who could infect life with their impure genes



that is so wrong it's a form of ethnic cleansing is'nt it ?
I find it hard to stomache that one human could treat another human like this regardless of age, race creed or colour.
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:31am

Its reminicent of the foundation m sanger created, planned parenthood to irradicate ethnic minorities and the "simple minded"

even the topic the nazi doctor was talking on...


"having quality "planned" children"

also reeks of pro choice ideologies.


Planned children is now planned parenthood, different terminolgy same ethos
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FISHX

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:39am

What makes a planned chid any better quality than a unplanned child is really the big question we should be asking pro choice.

Why is planned parenthood better than unplanned are they saying if the pregnancy is unplanned and allowed to continue that the baby when it is born is some way inferior to a planned baby? Or are they saying planned parent hood is somehow more rewarding than unplanned parenthood?
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:50am

Good questions!

I think other good questions (although if we take into account the reason m sanger created pp for and that she is still highly esteemed by the organisation) would be

who is doing the planning, the parents or the planned parenthood organisation?

Who does the organisation deem suitable to be parents?

Certainly not ethnic minorities or the working under-educated classes as they target for abortion and thus deemed unsuitable.

Could that be classed as a form of ethnic cleansing?
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FISHX

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Posted: 02-15-05 11:54am

izzy wrote:
good questions!


I think other good questions (although if we take into account the reason m sanger created pp for and that she is still highly esteemed by the organisation) would be

who is doing the planning, the parents or the planned parenthood organisation?


Who does the organisation deem suitable to be parents?


Certainly not ethnic minorities or the working under-educated classes as they target for abortion and thus deemed unsuitable.


Could that be classed as a form of ethnic cleansing?



great questions I direct izzy's above questions to any one pro choice .

If you look at it like that then yes it is a form of ethnic cleansing.
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-15-05 12:50pm

There are simularities between the nazi eugenics programme and the american eugenics programme. There is a link between hitlers ideologies and sanger and well established link between sanger and planned parenthood who have never denounced her ideologies in fact alan gutmacher former head of planned parenthood said he was proud to be following on the road sanger had mapped out.

What evidence do we have that planned parenthood isnt exersising a underhanded form of ethnic cleansing? And for what reasons should we trust their answers?

It may not be forced ethnic cleansing but is it manipulated ethnic cleansing?

I think the only reason why we dont automatically think of it this way is because we automatically think what the nazis did could never be repeated, especially not in the societies which fought against it but the american eugenics programme was being promoted before the nazis adopted it... Like the addage goes.... History repeats itself.
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-16-05 11:17am

"government pregnancy-reduction plan is about stopping lower classes breeding, claims expert"

http://www.Sundayherald.Com/33 403

the government's plan to cut teenage pregnancy in poor areas 'has elements of eugenics', according to a leading sociologist.

Frank furedi, professor of sociology at the university of kent at canterbury and the author of the bestseller paranoid parenting, says new labour and conservative governments' 'obsession' with reducing teenage pregnancy is driven by a desire to prevent the lower social classes from breeding.

'our government's policy on teenage pregnancy has a eugenic element -- it is really about preventing working-class girls from having children.

Middle-class girls from nice families do not have kids when they are teenagers. Teenage pregnancy can be seen as working-class girls having kids and depending on the welfare state.

'there is a class element and this is the basis of eugenics -- different fertility policies for different classes. They think the wrong type of people are breeding.'

'i am very unhappy with the way contraceptive implants are used,'

research into the contraceptive injection depo-provera shows that it is given primarily to single, unemployed women. A study carried out in north manchester showed that 89% of women given injections were single, 61% were full-time mothers and 31% were unemployed.

Dr rosemary barrett, a gp at rutherglen health centre in glasgow, claimed the injection was being used as a cheap way of preventing deprived single mothers from falling pregnant. 'the contraceptive injection is really marketed at poor areas, and it is given increasingly to younger women,' she said. 'i am noticing that more and more teenagers are being put on it.

Furedi was speaking ahead of a debate in london yesterday about eugenics, organised by the institute of ideas. In a keynote address he claimed the term 'eugenics' was unjustifiably associated with screening for genetic defects by critics who are concerned about our attitudes towards disability.

27 april 2003
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Izzy

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Posted: 02-16-05 11:22am

"selling sterilisation to addicts"
bbc news online

http://news.Bbc. Co.Uk/2/hi/americas/3189763.Stm
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Capagrl

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Posted: 03-03-05 16:25pm

Izzy, first let me say that i've read in other places much of what you posted and it is right on the money... Well, ha ha, the only thing not mentioned *yet* is the multi-million dollar annual income of planned parenthood.

Second, I need to express my absolute shock that steen hasn't seen fit to come along and blast you for being an emotional, morally superior-feeling, bible thumping, anti-woman whacko yet. It's quite shocking considering that's been his path before when someone dares mention the holocaust and abortion in the same context.

Must be nice to know that two weeks has gone by and steen still hasn't found a way to refute you without making himself out to look like... Well, we all know what he is and only he can do it best :-)

good job, izzy!
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Capagrl

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Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 34
Location: PA

Posted: 03-03-05 16:25pm

Izzy, first let me say that i've read in other places much of what you posted and it is right on the money... Well, ha ha, the only thing not mentioned *yet* is the multi-million dollar annual income of planned parenthood.

Second, I need to express my absolute shock that steen hasn't seen fit to come along and blast you for being an emotional, morally superior-feeling, bible thumping, anti-woman whacko yet. It's quite shocking considering that's been his path before when someone dares mention the holocaust and abortion in the same context.

Must be nice to know that two weeks has gone by and steen still hasn't found a way to refute you without making himself out to look like... Well, we all know what he is and only he can do it best :-)

good job, izzy!
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