Stan And Others, Does This Sound Familiar? Posted: 06-30-06 15:39pm
Hi. I found this forum with a search on
my symptoms and have been reading it for a
few days. It is very informative and
supportive and I commend you all.
I have had episodes of what I think is
hypoglycemia since my early 20's (about 20
years ago). It hasn't been constant but
when it rears it's ugly head it is severe
and unrelenting. In the earlier
episodes, I never knew what was happening
and had several doctors and thousands of $
worth of tests say that everything was
normal, was given rx for anxiety and sent
on my way. I never took the rx and
eventually my symptoms would get better -
somewhat. The last time I felt this bad
was about 5 years ago and I refused to
accept the anxiety/it's all in your head
dx. I researched the symptoms and went
on a hypoglycemic diet. I did get
better. Then I did something stupid.
Over the past 3 - 4 years I haven't
followed the diet exactly. I guess when
I began to feel "ok" I wanted to think it
was only a temporary thing and after a
while I thought it wasn't really as bad as
I remembered (like childbirth?) so I
started to eat the things I shouldn't more
and more. The last 6 months or so, i've
really eaten like the "normal" people.
You would think I would have learned!
Currently i'm having career stress and
anxiety and I have been traveling with
regards to work. My schedule was way off
last week - long days, little sleep and
improper meals. Toward the end of the
week I even suffered what can only be
described as a panic attack. To sum it
up I crashed on monday of this week after
flying home from that week long
conference.
The past four days have been horrible. I
feel weak, sweaty, dizzy, lightheaded,
shaky, hungry, headachy, nauseous (it's
hard to be hungry and nauseous at the same
time isn't it?) most of the time. My
symptoms have not been relieved with
proper meals, though I have felt a bit
better in the evenings these last two
days. I had fasting bloodwork done this
morning by my doctor after I called on
tuesday and managed to squeeze in an appt.
Could I be feeling so horrible today
because I was fasting this a.M.? How do
you tell the difference between
hypoglycemia and carbohydrate withdrawal
symptoms. I'm sure i'm having that too
because of the high carb content of my
diet up until tuesday of this week. I
don't remember from 5 years ago how long
it took before I felt better after
beginning the diet - but I also don't
remember feeling this exhausted, weak and
spacey. It is so bad right now that I
can't imagine working. That is stressing
me out even more as I have an out of town
client arriving tomorrow for a full
weekend of work!
I'm sorry I sound a bit panicked but I
guess I am.
Thanks to stan and anyone who might shed
some light.
Be well,
r
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Stan
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Posted: 06-30-06 17:02pm
Definitely sounds like hypoglycemia.
Carbohydrate withdrawal would not be that
bad, what you're experiencing is simply
the pancreas going back into the mode it
was in previously. It's simply shooting
out more insulin because you've been
eating bad and it assumes the worst.
Everything you mention points to it,
unfortunately including the lack of
support from doctors. You felt better at
night because of the obvious, your system
had more sugar in it after the day. And
yes, fasting in the morning would effect
you later because you weren't eating
anything, not to mention that test
requires you to drink straight sugar.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Sound Familiar? Posted: 06-30-06 17:18pm
Stan,
thanks for your reply. I also read where
you recommended not to eat less than 60
carbs and I think that this week I haven't
been eating 60. I have such a severe
reaction every time I eat that I am afraid
to eat much of anything except meats and
good fats. Maybe I should add some
additional complex carbs in. I don't
think I could feel worse.
Ever felt a headache in the top of your
head and what feels like a weight pressing
down on your head and shoulders?
Thanks again for your reply. I really
appreciate it.
R
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Stan
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Posted: 06-30-06 17:31pm
It's been awhile since I had headaches,
but I don't recall them feeling like that.
Don't worry though, everyone has their
own symptoms, the headaches themselves are
one, it depends on the person how they
manifest. Mine were pretty much spot
headaches where it would ache and feel
awful in only one little area for all day.
Add some leafy greens in and try to get
a comfortable carb level. It will be a
few days before your body calms down a
bit.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 06-30-06 17:41pm
I will add the leafy greens in and try to
be patient. I'm looking forward to what
my bloodwork shows -although if they said
it was anything other than "normal" i'd be
surprised.
It is puzzling though that there are so
many of us and we still don't get more
respect within the medical community.
Thanks stan. You're the best.
Be well,
r
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Stan
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Posted: 06-30-06 17:49pm
Please keep in mind they may determine
what you have is normal when it isn't.
If they say this, come back with your
results and i'll interpret them.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 06-30-06 18:08pm
I will come back and let you know either
way what they say. I'd love to hear your
take on the results.
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mendigoodwin
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 34
Posted: 06-30-06 20:15pm
Hi renni,
i have had the headache! It is
definitely a pressure in the top of my
head and if I put pressure on the top of
my head it helps offset the pressure in my
head. There for a while it was so
intense my husband would lay his heavy arm
across my head to relieve the pain before
the meds could kick in. I went through
the same issues with my doctors. They
kept thinking it was mental illness, but I
continued to insist that it was related to
what I was eating. Eventually I
requested the glucose tolerance testing
and the diagnosis ended up being reactive
hypoglycemia. Then the nutritionist told
me to eat wholewheat stuff and things like
half a banana with breakfast. I already
knew I could not handle that stuff and had
wiped it out of my diet. I started the
diet stan recommends about 5 weeks ago.
My headaches are gone except for days that
I try to eat the recommended fruit on the
diet. Because i'm not getting the fruit,
I try to eat a bit more of the vegetable
of the day to keep the carbs up. I don't
think i'm gettting 60 carbs a day. I,
like you, am just too afraid at this point
to try too many things other than the
vegetables from the list, meat, eggs,
olive oil, and the nuts. I know I feel
better now than I have in a very, very
long time. This diet has helped my drop
some extra weight, but I still have about
20 pounds to go. I feel better and have
increased my walking, but have not started
lifting weights or doing strenous activity
yet. I know that exercise helps as well.
I hope you find something that works for
you.
This site has been the best source of
support and information I can find -
including my endocrinologist and
nutritionist!
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 06-30-06 22:29pm
Hi mendi,
thanks for your kind words and help.
It's the strangest kind of pressure
headache. I feel better this evening
than I did earlier today and like stan
said earlier i'm sure it's because I have
the right levels of sugar in my blood
stream late in the day.
This week I have been getting cold clammy
sweats about an hour to an hour and a half
after I eat anything. I remember having
done this before when my system was so
overloaded. It took a while before I
didn't have some type of reaction to food
- no matter what food I ate.
Hopefully things will calm down soon.
Your post gives me hope!
Thanks again.
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Stan
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Posted: 07-15-06 21:44pm
One thing guys, you don't have to avoid
everything on that list, I just recommend
it from experience. You're always free
to try something on there if you really
want to.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Blood Work Results In Posted: 07-15-06 22:16pm
Stan
i posted my lab results yesterday but it
along with half of this thread has
disappeared. Maybe there is a glitch in
this board?
Did you see the post?
What a lot of typing only for it to
disappear!
R
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Stan
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Posted: 07-16-06 07:05am
Yeah, I noticed that there was some sort
of glitch when it came up. Sorry man,
repost! I tried various ways to see it
because I knew that's what you posted.
Maybe it was too big. All I need to see
are the numbers for each hour. So I need
to see fasting level, first hour (or half
hour depending on the lab) and so forth.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 07-16-06 09:31am
Well.....They didn't do a glucose
tolerance test. Only general bloodwork
but my fasting glucose level was 83. I
know that doesn't mean a lot. My Dr.
Also said that she was doing some blood
test that would give her my insulin levels
for the past three months? I don't know
which one of all those they did was that
particular one, but nonetheless all of
them (all 50 or so) were within normal
range.
However i've done gt tests before and they
were "normal" too but I know how I feel
after I eat and what seems to make me feel
better. I know my symptoms are all
related to my blood sugar levels. My Dr.
Did say that she would refer me to an
endo if I wanted to check it out further
and I have a follow up with her in a month
so if the diet has not significantly
improved my symptoms I will ask for the
referral.
Three weeks ago, I could barely get out of
bed with severe fatigue, dizzyness, aches
in my legs and arms, sweats etc. I was
scared it was something other than
hypoglycemia. One thing that you said in
an earlier post that stuck in my mind was
that if it 'comes and goes' it's hypo.
That is exactly what mine does, so i've
relaxed and stopped obsessing about what
else it might be and am concentrating on
all the principles of low blood sugar.
At times during the past week or so, I
have felt really good. I almost didn't
want to eat because I instinctively knew
that when I did the symptoms would start
up. One day, I delayed my meal because I
felt so good. Guess what? Within a
couple of hours of eating, I was shaky, in
a sweat, and in the midst of what felt
like a panic attack. Now if I measure
the difference I feel now as opposed to
three weeks ago it is obvious i'm better.
The symptoms are not constant as they
were then. I had a constant slighlty
"off-balance" feeling that would progress
into vertigo at times. Now that symptom
comes and goes depending on my activity
level, and the food that I eat. Even a
"good" meal will make me have some
(although it might be minor) symptoms
within an hour of eating. I learned that
I can't eat even the tiniest amount of
whole grains yet, but I will tolerate a
couple of berries later in the day.
Breakfast is my most important meal and it
has to be perfect or I set myself up for a
day of misery.
I hope things will continue to calm down
and in a month when I see the Dr. Again
it will be quite obvious what is going on.
My fatigue level is much better and I
have been able (with a little difficulty
but still...) to work and do normal
things.
Your thoughts? Would it be advantageous
of me to purchase a glucose monitor to
check my levels or is that not a very
accurate gauge for this type of
condition?
Thanks for your concern,
r
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Stan
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Posted: 07-16-06 15:36pm
Damn it, I just made a huge post that
would have made you feel even better but
something is wrong with this damn system.
Seriously, what the hell? Pretty much I
said it's evident hypoglycemia is likely
the only problem, the fasting level means
nothing it only shows you you don't have
fasting hypoglycemia (where you could eat
anything), and a glucose meter is pretty
much superfluous because you can't learn
anything from a meter that you can't learn
from feeling like crap after you eat
something bad.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 07-16-06 16:15pm
Well damn it - repost it if it's gonna
make me feel better! :)
see! I told you this board has a glitch.
Something is seriously wrong because I
had a lot more posts on this thread that
have just disappeared.
Ok...Question. At first, did you still
have some symptoms after eating even when
you were eating the right things? I am
still having a bit of fatigue and/or
slight flushing, etc. An hour or two
after I eat. Even when I eat exactly
like i'm supposed to. It seems that
breakfast is like that more than any other
meal or snack. ?? Has it just not been
long enough for things to calm down
completely? I've been following the diet
strictly for almost three weeks.
R
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Stan
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Posted: 07-16-06 19:31pm
Okay, here goes!
1. Your fasting level means nothing. I
know nothing of any other test but the gtt
that will show hypoglycemia.
Furthermore, it's never really the level
of the drop but how fast, always remember
that. You could have a fasting of 85,
take the sugar, watch it rise to 105, and
then drop to 65. This is normal, for
diabetes. Not for hypoglycemia. Once
that happens the body and brain cannot
keep up with the speed of the drop and you
get your symptoms.
2. If it was low when you had the fasting
level, all it would show is you have
fasting hypoglycemia, where you can eat
anything. But you don't.
3. The good thing is you're seeing that
eating directly effects how you feel and
from what you said I pretty much gaurantee
you have the saw-tooth curve. That's
what it means if you're feeling a drop
within 1-2 hours after eating. I used to
get them within 1.
4. The unfortunate thing is the healing
process takes a lot of time. Three weeks
is nothing, it's like a decade in an eon.
Well, not that extreme. The good thing
is you see you can feel better on the
diet, which pretty much verifies you have
hypoglycemia so don't worry about
anything. Remember, never worry about a
symptom unless it persists almost every
day for at least two weeks and it has
nothing to do with your eating.
5. Another verification is that you said
you can eat berries later in the day.
That's because your body at that time has
built up enough energy to counteract any
possible drops. Classic hypoglycemia.
6. Not tolerating grains is another one,
and many people can't eat them at first,
regardless of what different diets say.
We'll worry about this much later,
whenever I figure how to add them back in
myself!
7. Another marker of the hypoglycemia is
that if breakfast is not right you have a
bad day. Classic.
8. Remember, you're doing better. You
may not be fully there yet, but you can
tell there's a difference, always remember
that. That will keep your mind at ease
if you start to obsess. Your symptoms
don't sound too extreme, so I think you'll
be fine. One girl here once, who i'm
pretty sure had hypoglycemia, was going
crazy. As far as I know she tried the
high-carb diet after not being able to
deal with the low-carb and she disappeared
a few months ago. I'm not sure what
happened to her. Anyway, I bring her up
because she went crazy about other
diseases, obsessed about them nearly every
day and got tested for everything under
the sun.
9. I myself thought about the monitor,
but it seems superfluous to me. I mean,
you can tell when you eat something bad
because you feel like crap, all the
monitor will do is show you what the level
is. Not going to help any because you
can't do anything about it at that time,
you can just say yep, uh huh, it be low,
and then sit there. Considering that
good ones cost upwards of 80 dollars, I
don't think it's worth it or necessary.
10. The main problem now is that you
can't really do anything about the drops.
You should notice that you get a little
physical sensation before anything else
comes on, so you could always try having a
few nuts or some fat or meat right before
it gets worse. That can help, just don't
make a big habit of it, remember we're
trying to retrain the pancreas, not allow
it to continue what it's doing. It's not
like eating a bit more would do that, but
you want your body to say okay, I have to
cut it out because he's not giving me
anything.
11. A further note, i've decided to add
back in a multi-vitamin to my diet, but
only in very, very small amounts, like 1/3
of a tablet. I found that in one day I
noticed a change, most likely because my
diet is low in b vitamins. You may want
to look into one, and add it to the
morning meal. Make sure you read the
label if you do and check to see if there
is anything at all in it. The best
vitamins can only be bought at organic
health food stores and will say stuff on
the label like "contains no starch, sugar,
grain..." that's what you want. I'm
going to research into foods that carry
enough b vitamins. That's the only
problem with the diet, I researched and
this seems to be the only way to get them
without going all grain crazy. It might
help out your vertigo and everything if
you try it. Just make sure not to take
what the label says, it's always
unnecessary. You don't need 1,236% of
vitamin b6 every day. I forget what mine
says for a tablet, something like 600%, so
1/3 of that is plenty.
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Stan
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Posted: 07-16-06 19:37pm
Oh yeah, and yes, I was still getting
symptoms at first. They started to all
go away within ummm I think about three
months, I could notice a really big change
by then. I still get an occasional drop.
You'll see that, as you progress, you
might have extreme sweeps in energy levels
throughout the day. Then, suddenly, as
if out of nowhere, you'll notice you have
a good day, and then a bit of dropping the
next. Then, again, you'll notice it
happen every three days perhaps. Then
once a week, then once every two weeks for
maybe two days in a row, then once every
four and then you'll realize it's just
going away, though slowly. That's why
keeping a little calendar with my
plus/minus system on it can help with
that. When I feel great I put a plus on
that particular day. When I feel
generally good most of the day with maybe
just a little trouble, I put a circle with
a plus in it. When I have an okay day,
neither good nor bad really, I put a
circle. When I have a generally bad day,
I put a circle with a minus. When I have
a terrible day I put a minus. I've never
had a minus on this diet. Never. And
currently i've been symptom free for
several days. Always remember it may
come back here and there as you get
better, don't fret if it does, keep going.
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 07-17-06 12:41pm
Thanks for reposting your reply from
before. I really appreciate it.
You're right and I know that the fasting
level means nothing. And to be honest I
think my internist is only as knowledgable
about hypoglycemia as the general
physician population (not very). She was
kind and understanding and offered a
referral to an endo so that's about all I
could ask for I guess.
I think I have that saw tooth curve too.
Just based on how i've heard it
described.
As for the grains, I wonder why almost
every single hypo diet has you eating
whole grains from the very beginning? I
can't do it. I wish I could, but I
can't. I don't feel any better at all
when I do.
I am doing better. I'm certainly still
having a lot of issues and like the girl
who used to post here that you referred
to, I do some obsessing. I may sound
like i've got it all together and everyone
tells me that I look like i've got it all
together, but believe me....On the inside
- it's not all together! Since shortly
after I really crashed with the hypo
symptoms a few weeks ago i've begun having
issues with chronic anxiety and panic
attacks. A lot of the symptoms of hypo
also mimic panic attack and I have found
in the past few weeks that when I feel the
symptoms for hypo beginning it will start
a panic attack. Especially in crowds or
where i'm somewhere that I feel I can't
"freak out". I had issues with panic and
anxiety in my early 20's. It's amazing
how your body never forgets and can become
sensitized to that so quickly even after
not having one in years!
As for that sensation just before the big
drop. I do get that. Right now, i've
been rushing for something to eat (a few
nuts or some cheese) because I don't want
to have that bottomed out feeling again.
I think my pancreas must not want to
retrain - it must be stubborn but so am i.
As for the vitamins, I agree. Everything
in moderation. I don't think you need
5000% of anything! You'll set yourself
up for other problems usually. I do take
a multi a day and recently read up on
whole food vitamins as opposed to
synthetic. Sounds logical to me.
I'll try keeping a calendar like you do
and that way I can see how and if my
symptoms are getting better.
Unfortunately I think i've gotten back
into the "panic/anxiety" cycle and it's
hard to tell what is hypo and what is
anxiety.
The positives are that I do have some
times that I feel good. They may not be
long times - usually just a few hours at a
time, but it's something. After a good
time, just like you said, I seem to have a
worse than before time and it usually
lasts longer than what the good time was.
<sigh>
thanks for sharing. I have hope - but I
just have a long way to go and i'm not a
patient person.
R
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DianaJJ
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 02 Mar 2006 Posts: 100 Location: California
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Posted: 07-17-06 14:01pm
Hi renni,
you're right, we lost many of the posting
on this forum and the other health forum
that we post on! Very strange.
I can't believe how similar our symptoms
are. You wrote:
even a "good" meal will make me have some
(although it might be minor) symptoms
within an hour of eating. I learned that
I can't eat even the tiniest amount of
whole grains yet, but I will tolerate a
couple of berries later in the day.
Breakfast is my most important meal and it
has to be perfect or I set myself up for a
day of misery.
That's exactly how I used to feel. I
could never eat grains or fruit especially
early in the day. It would set me up for
a whole day of awful symptoms. I also
had those "pressure headaches" you talk
about. I also have the panic attacks
too. It's just so difficult to tell
whether it's from the hypoglycemia or
menopause.
Keep sticking with the diet and i'm sure
you'll see improvement. It took months
before I was feeling better most of the
time.
Dj
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Renni
New User, Becoming EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 25 Location: Arizona
Posted: 07-17-06 19:23pm
Dj:
isn't this board strange?
You're right - is it hypo, anxiety, meno
or ?? Something else. My first symptoms
were hypoglycemic though and since i've
done this before since I was in my teens I
think it came first ... And then the
panic/anxiety in my 20's and now in my
40's who knows what's happening. I just
know that I must follow a hypo diet or I
simply can't 'go'. No energy, the
fatigue is crushing, sweats, vivid
nightmares, constant hunger, craving for
sugar, weak limbs....And on and on.
The last time I did this (about 5 or 6
years ago), I followed a low carb plan and
got relief in a while. I don't remember
how long it took before I felt normal
again. After a time, I began to feel
really good but I was faithful to the diet
for several years - got to the point where
I allowed myself to eat occasional
"forbiddens" like bread or (gasp) even a
dessert once in a while and I did ok.
Then I started a stressful, on the go
career and my diet went out the window.
It didn't take it's toll until now. I
guess if I really analyze it, I was having
symptoms and just ignoring them until the
crash a few weeks ago. No way I could
ignore it.
Anyway, I really appreciate you guys on
this message board. We'll keep each
other going.
