the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-10-07 12:08pm
I thought that this was interesting. I
was reading my local paper online and
found this tiny little blurb in the 'back'
section of it.
"ATLANTA – Kroger Co. said today it was
reiterating its drug policies to its
pharmacists after a Georgia woman claimed
she was denied the so-called “morning
after” pill at one of the company’s
stores."
That's the entire article. They really
just don't want you to know. This is the
first I have seen in the news that Kroger
will carry the map. And it doesn't say
anything about needing a prescription or
not.
Anyone else see stuff like this?
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Birch
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Posted: 03-11-07 23:09pm
Well, I guess this topic sucks.
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Jules
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Posted: 03-12-07 01:25am
No it doesn't suck - I just haven't come
across anything like your story and didn't
have anything to say.
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diamondsz
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Posted: 03-12-07 03:07am
I dont know why its being denied, it
should be made available to everyone. I
think its a good topic would be nice to
know more information though but I think
they have lawyers put a stop on media
cause this could get way out of hand.
On another note I wonder what their going
to do, a few pharmacists have already said
they would refuse the morning after pill
to customers, so if they get fired would
that be grounds for human rights to back
in? Honestly if you have a christian
pharmacist and someone of another religion
can they actually refuse to give them the
morning after pill?
|
Moo
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Posted: 03-12-07 08:06am
Yes, I've heard of women being refused
emergency contraception on the grounds of
moral opposition of the pharmasist.
I guess that's up to the person dispencing
it - HOWEVER the same as the
conscientious objection rule with abortion
should apply (although, technically this
only involves actual involvement in the
procedure and referal is, arguably, not
part of the procedure...whole other topic
lol) but if someone objects to dispensing
it on moral grounds then they should
simply have another pharmacist do it.
|
Tylanas
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Posted: 03-12-07 12:24pm
diamondsz
wrote:
I dont know why its being
denied, it should be made available to
everyone. I think its a good topic would
be nice to know more information though
but I think they have lawyers put a stop
on media cause this could get way out of
hand.
On another note I wonder what their going
to do, a few pharmacists have already said
they would refuse the morning after pill
to customers, so if they get fired would
that be grounds for human rights to back
in? Honestly if you have a christian
pharmacist and someone of another religion
can they actually refuse to give them the
morning after
pill?
Someone's religion cannot interfere with
their public job... That is denying the
custsomer their own rights.
if it was a private, family-owned pharmacy
then yes, I could understand their right
not to sell the pill. But if it is a
national chain, then a corporation cannot
deny and entire nation the right to buy
something based on religion.
Last edited by Tylanas on 03-12-07 21:53pm; edited 1 time in total
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nightangel73
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Posted: 03-12-07 18:23pm
diamondsz
wrote:
I dont know why its being
denied, it should be made available to
everyone. I think its a good topic would
be nice to know more information though
but I think they have lawyers put a stop
on media cause this could get way out of
hand.
On another note I wonder what their going
to do, a few pharmacists have already said
they would refuse the morning after pill
to customers, so if they get fired would
that be grounds for human rights to back
in? Honestly if you have a christian
pharmacist and someone of another religion
can they actually refuse to give them the
morning after
pill?
my neighbor growing up she was pharmacist
and she never dispensed abortion pills of
course she is religious. Her husbad who
was pharmacist he did dispensed them.
However I don't think she would have had a
problem dispensing the morning after pill,
because that's just a contraceptive pill.
If i were pharmacist I would be just like
her. I would never dispense abortion
pills.
|
Birch
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Posted: 03-12-07 19:31pm
My point was kinda more about the media
bias in reporting this kind of thing, but
I guess the tangent was inevitable.
Is there a kind of 'code of ethics' for
pharmacists? I know in the social work
field there's a pretty well respected code
of ethics social workers must follow or
there are pretty steep consequences.
|
nightangel73
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Posted: 03-12-07 20:21pm
Eiri
wrote:
But if it is a national
chain, then a corporation cannot deny and
entire nation the right to buy something
based on religion.
Even if it's a national chain they can
deny buy something based on whatever
reason the Ceo wants. If you run a store
you decide what to sell and what not to
sell. Heck the birth control pill i'm
using eckerd pharmacy don't want to sell
it. I asked if they could please order for
me but they denied it. Then I went to
walmart and they had no problem ordering
for me.
|
diamondsz
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Posted: 03-12-07 21:02pm
nightangel73
wrote:
diamondsz
wrote:
I dont know why its being
denied, it should be made available to
everyone. I think its a good topic would
be nice to know more information though
but I think they have lawyers put a stop
on media cause this could get way out of
hand.
On another note I wonder what their going
to do, a few pharmacists have already said
they would refuse the morning after pill
to customers, so if they get fired would
that be grounds for human rights to back
in? Honestly if you have a christian
pharmacist and someone of another religion
can they actually refuse to give them the
morning after
pill?
my neighbor growing up she was pharmacist
and she never dispensed abortion pills of
course she is religious. Her husbad who
was pharmacist he did dispensed them.
However I don't think she would have had a
problem dispensing the morning after pill,
because that's just a contraceptive pill.
If i were pharmacist I would be just like
her. I would never dispense abortion
pills.
Explain to me why the "morning after pill"
is considered an abortion pill? As far as
Im concerned its a preventative as is
birth control or condoms
|
nightangel73
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Posted: 03-12-07 21:49pm
diamondsz
wrote:
Explain to me why the "morning after pill"
is considered an abortion pill? As far as
Im concerned its a preventative as is
birth control or
condoms
Yes diamond. The morning after pill is
different to the abortion pill. I wouldn't
have problem dispensing morning after
pills but I would definetly deny selling
the abortion pill.
|
jenn_smithson
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 15 Nov 2004 Posts: 808 Location: Texas
Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-19-07 11:51am
Birch
wrote:
I thought that this was
interesting. I was reading my local paper
online and found this tiny little blurb in
the 'back' section of it.
"ATLANTA – Kroger Co. said today it was
reiterating its drug policies to its
pharmacists after a Georgia woman claimed
she was denied the so-called “morning
after” pill at one of the company’s
stores."
That's the entire article. They really
just don't want you to know. This is the
first I have seen in the news that Kroger
will carry the map. And it doesn't say
anything about needing a prescription or
not.
Anyone else see stuff like
this?
You don't need a
prescription, the FDA f-i-n-a-l-l-y made ec
available over the counter.
Reiterating their policy can mean
different things. Obviously, they sell it
because they have a report of someone
being denied the purchase. So, the
question then is how will they re-word their
policies? They can either become more
restrictive, which usually earns them a
boycott by angry women, or they can
address the concerns of their pharmacists
and allow an out for those who don't want
to do their jobs while still providing the
product to their customers.
As to the media, it's always been the case
that women's health receives poor mention
in the media. It only started being
different when breast cancer advocates
took a visible, loud stand (and it became
"trendy" in hollywood"). Few women who
would benefit from emergency contraception
knows that it exists and you can thank the
media, the "prolife" movement, and
cowardly corporations for that.
First, the media is terrified of covering
stories about women's reproductive health
care because they fear the backlash from
antiabortion activists. These people call
and write the newspaper every
time there's a story that is either
positive (rare) or ambivalent about
reproductive issues and complain that the
"other side" was not presented in the
article. This happens for every issue,
not just contraception. The hpv vaccine
coverage is the same way. Anytime anyone
writes anything positive about the cancer
prevention vaccine, the next day there are
letters to the editor about how it will
cause mass orgies to break out amongst 12
year olds because the only thing stopping
them now is the threat of hpv
(and yes, that was me being profoundly sarcastic).
The "other side", however, rarely - if
ever - has anything productive to say
about the .a.c.t.u.a.l problem. The
problem is not that women obtain
abortions. The problem is that
they experience unintended pregnancies
which lead to abortions. Therefore any
discussion about emergency contraception,
which has the propensity to prevent
hundreds of thousands of unintended
pregnancies .i.f it can be accessed, is
treated to an inane
'keep-your-legs-closed-or-else' message by
the local (or national) "prolife"
leadership.
We .k.n.o.w that sex can
cause pregnancy. Thank you for your
constant reminders but we know. Now that
you know we know, can we please discuss
the best ways to prevent pregnancy while
being
realistic and realizing that over 90% of
people have sex at least once a week and
the vast majority of them don't want to
become pregnant?! Is it too much
to ask that we actually acknowledge reality
and work to prevent pregnancies with
methods that .d.o work.
Abstinence doesn't work because no one
really chooses it. Telling people to
abstain as the "other side" of taking
emergency contraception fails to account
for the reality that if someone is
interested in emergency contraception,
they have
already had sex or are thinking about
having sex!!!
Corporations afraid of a mass boycott have
refused to manufacture ec even though they
already manufacture birth control (and you
can thank the "prolife" leadership for
that one too). Emergency contraception
was available to other countries long
before it became available in the united
states because the corporations dispensing
it didn't have to worry about boycotts or
backlashes over there. It seems that
other prolifers around the world recognize
something that ours do not - the simple
fact that emergency contraception is
.n.o.t the abortion pill! However, when
the corporations started looking at the
american market, they balked at the
response they were promised from the
"prolife" leadership if they manufactured
the pills for the us. A new company had
to be built (by women in the prochoice
movement) that would manufacture and sell
the pill in the us (this is before it
received over-the-counter status). When
the other corporations witnessed that you
could be successful in manufacturing and
selling the pill in the us if you just
ignored the idiots, they bought the
company out and finally grew a backbone.
However, their initial fear cost us
several years in having emergency
contraception available.
Basically, if you noticed the common
thread through this whole mini-history,
you can thank the "prolife" movement for
any discussion of ec being buried or
"balanced" with the "other side."
Strange, isn't it, that a movement that
claims it's only purpose is to prevent
abortions would stand in the way of a
simple pill regimen that could prevent
hundreds of thousands of abortions each
year?
|
jenn_smithson
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 15 Nov 2004 Posts: 808 Location: Texas
Posted: 03-19-07 12:04pm
nightangel73
wrote:
Eiri
wrote:
But if it is a national
chain, then a corporation cannot deny and
entire nation the right to buy something
based on religion.
Even if it's a national chain they can
deny buy something based on whatever
reason the Ceo wants. If you run a store
you decide what to sell and what not to
sell. Heck the birth control pill i'm
using eckerd pharmacy don't want to sell
it. I asked if they could please order for
me but they denied it. Then I went to
walmart and they had no problem ordering
for me.
This is different than
what we are discussing.
Imagine that you own a soda counter, all
you do is stock and sell soda's. Through
agreements, you decide to only sell coke
and coke products. Someone comes to you
and wants a pepsi and you turn them away
because you don't sell it. That's fine.
That's your right, you don't have to stock
something you don't want to stock and no
one is trying to make you stock something
you don't want to sell. So the person is
turned away without a pepsi because you
just don't carry it.
Now Imagine the same scenario as above but
that you've hired an employee to stand at
the counter so that you don't have to be
there all day anymore. This employee,
though, does not like Sprite, they have
strong, negative beliefs about sprite and
believe that it should not be consumed by
anyone based on their own beliefs.
Someone comes up and asks for a sprite and
the employee turns them away. Sprite is a
coke product so you .d.o
stock it. It's there and it's available
when someone else is working the counter
other than that one employee. The
customer complains to you.
The second scenario is what is going on
right now. Pharmacies are stocking
emergency contraception but pharmacists -
the employees - are refusing to dispense
what the store owner/manager has deemed
worthy to sell. Even national chains are
choosing to stock and sell emergency
contraception but the individual
pharmacists - employees - are denying to
dispense it based on their own personal
moral and religious beliefs.
I'm sorry but if I owned one of these
stores, I would fire the employees who did
not want to actually do the jobs I hired
them for. I hired them to dispense
medications for people who have legal
prescriptions or valid requests (if the
medication is over the counter like ec).
If they refuse to do their job, they
should be fired or asked to leave in
pursuit of another career path. I hired
them to do a specific job. I did not hire
them to preach at or pass judgement on my
customers.
|
nightangel73
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Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-20-07 21:15pm
jenn_smithson
wrote:
Abstinence doesn't work because no one
really chooses it. Telling people to
abstain as the "other side" of taking
emergency contraception fails to account
for the reality that if someone is
interested in emergency contraception,
they have
already had sex or are thinking about
having sex!!!
I did choose abstinence jenn. For 31 years
i did. And my mom choose abstinence too.
And all my mom's 4 sisters also choose
abstinence. And all my female cousins
choose abstinence too. Too bad the culture
here doesn't promote it because it really
works. Abstinence is exactly what i will
teach my future children.
|
jenn_smithson
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 15 Nov 2004 Posts: 808 Location: Texas
Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-20-07 21:50pm
nightangel73
wrote:
I did choose abstinence
jenn. For 31 years i did. And my mom
choose abstinence too. And all my mom's 4
sisters also choose abstinence. And all my
female cousins choose abstinence too. Too
bad the culture here doesn't promote it
because it really works. Abstinence is
exactly what i will teach my future
children.
98% of all people, ever, have had sex.
90% of people have sex by the time they
are 21, the vast majority of them are also
unmarried.
These figures are also true for older
people, people born in the 1940s
(according to an abc news study).
I'm sure some of your family claims to
have abstained, but if I were putting my
money on anything I would put it on them
having had sex and just telling you
another story. The same thing happens in
many families. My own Aunt told me she
was a virgin on her wedding night until I
compared the date of my cousin's birth
with the date of her wedding! It happens,
it's always happened, and it
will always happen.
Your anecdotal stories of alleged
abstinence don't change the reality and
the reality is that the vast majority of
people have sex by the time they are 20
and the majority of them are not married.
Further, the reality is that this has been
the reality even when sexuality was
repressed by the culture and something
that you didn't really talk about.
|
Birch
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Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-20-07 22:29pm
nightangel73
wrote:
jenn_smithson
wrote:
Abstinence doesn't work because no one
really chooses it. Telling people to
abstain as the "other side" of taking
emergency contraception fails to account
for the reality that if someone is
interested in emergency contraception,
they have
already had sex or are thinking about
having sex!!!
I did choose abstinence jenn. For 31 years
i did. And my mom choose abstinence too.
And all my mom's 4 sisters also choose
abstinence. And all my female cousins
choose abstinence too. Too bad the culture
here doesn't promote it because it really
works. Abstinence is exactly what i will
teach my future
children.
People in committed relationships should
not have to choose abstinence soley to
avoid unwanted conception. Sex is not
only about making little miniatures of
yourself. The technology is there to
avoid unwanted pregnancy and the ensuing
burden on society. Full use of it should
be endorsed by everyone.
Nightangel, did you tell your mom about
your views that sex after 25 is "okay" and
that you've broken your vow of abstinence
before you were married? If not, and you
don't have to say it-- then you are doing
exactly what has probably happend in the
past. Good lord, my mother taught me that
sex was inherently bad and something to
put up with, and that sex before marriage
is the worst thing you could ever do (she
told me once she'd rather I was an
alcoholic than having sex) but she
conceived my brother well before her
marriage and in her senior year of high
school. Always a joy, that "discussion"
about sex. You tell your kids your
ideals, and they don't listen, but then
they tell their kids their ideals, and
they don't listen...and everyone just lies
about it perpetually.
|
nightangel73
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Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-20-07 22:57pm
Birch
wrote:
Nightangel, did you tell your mom about
your views that sex after 25 is "okay" and
that you've broken your vow of abstinence
before you were married? If not, and you
don't have to say it-- then you are doing
exactly what has probably happend in the
past. Good lord, my mother taught me that
sex was inherently bad and something to
put up with, and that sex before marriage
is the worst thing you could ever do (she
told me once she'd rather I was an
alcoholic than having sex) but she
conceived my brother well before her
marriage and in her senior year of high
school. Always a joy, that "discussion"
about sex. You tell your kids your
ideals, and they don't listen, but then
they tell their kids their ideals, and
they don't listen...and everyone just lies
about it
perpetually.
actually yes I told my mom i was going to
break the vows of abstinence before
marriage because I was old enough and I
did waited for a good fair amount of time.
She didn't applause the idea but she
didn't told me no you can't. She must
obsviously know I have had sex but you
better believe she doesn't ask me about
it. She don't want to hear the answer
hehehe
I guarantee you that my mom do preach as
she says. There is no evidence that any of
my mom's sisters or all my female cousins
that they did had conceived a child ahead
from the wedding. Even my mom's sister who
married at 37 she married virgin. I
respect a lot my aunt for that you can
imagine that takes a lot of guts. So I'm
the one breaking the tradition, shame on
me. Now I guarantee you that I will make
sure my future kids do not have sex before
their 20 birthday. That's something I'm
still entitled to preach.
|
Tylanas
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Re: the Media & the Morning After Pill Posted: 03-21-07 01:10am
Birch
wrote:
nightangel73
wrote:
jenn_smithson
wrote:
Abstinence doesn't work because no one
really chooses it. Telling people to
abstain as the "other side" of taking
emergency contraception fails to account
for the reality that if someone is
interested in emergency contraception,
they have
already had sex or are thinking about
having sex!!!
I did choose abstinence jenn. For 31 years
i did. And my mom choose abstinence too.
And all my mom's 4 sisters also choose
abstinence. And all my female cousins
choose abstinence too. Too bad the culture
here doesn't promote it because it really
works. Abstinence is exactly what i will
teach my future
children.
People in committed relationships should
not have to choose abstinence soley to
avoid unwanted conception. Sex is not
only about making little miniatures of
yourself. The technology is there to
avoid unwanted pregnancy and the ensuing
burden on society. Full use of it should
be endorsed by everyone.
Nightangel, did you tell your mom about
your views that sex after 25 is "okay" and
that you've broken your vow of abstinence
before you were married? If not, and you
don't have to say it-- then you are doing
exactly what has probably happend in the
past. Good lord, my mother taught me that
sex was inherently bad and something to
put up with, and that sex before marriage
is the worst thing you could ever do (she
told me once she'd rather I was an
alcoholic than having sex) but she
conceived my brother well before her
marriage and in her senior year of high
school. Always a joy, that "discussion"
about sex. You tell your kids your
ideals, and they don't listen, but then
they tell their kids their ideals, and
they don't listen...and everyone just lies
about it
perpetually.
Yeah, when I was really young I was taught
abstinance until marriage, except that
part way through highscool I think, my mom
told me that she hadn't actually waited
until marriage. Then, soon after than,
when I was first in college and my 3 year
relationship was just new, she helped me
get on birth control because she knew I,
like her, was most likely already having
sex. And I was.
|
Moo
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Joined: 20 Feb 2006 Posts: 1066 Location: London
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Posted: 03-21-07 06:38am
My mum taught me abstinence too (she was a
virgin when she married, she was also a
teenager though - still married though,
not doing bad ).
However, my mum also realised that it was
healthy to teach me about safe sex because
she realised that most people don't
abstain. Best teaching is always all
options
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nightangel73
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Posted: 03-21-07 18:08pm
Moo
wrote:
My mum taught me abstinence
too (she was a virgin when she married,
she was also a teenager though - still
married though, not doing bad ).
However, my mum also realised that it was
healthy to teach me about safe sex because
she realised that most people don't
abstain. Best teaching is always all
options
my mom couldn't teached me about safe sex
because i always knew more than her about
it. hehe I'm the one teaching my mom about
the birth control methods out there and
it's effects. I would definetly teach my
kids about birth control but not to say
that because they know about it they will
use it. Abstinence is what I will teach
them to use.
(and yes, that was me being 
