Abortion Debate Forum - Contraception page 3
medical questions | health forums

Contraception

New Topic  Reply  Ask A Doctor - Offline
Medical Questions-> Health Forums -> Abortion Debate -> Contraception
Author Message
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-20-07 17:48pm

Birch wrote:
Eiri wrote:
pro-life believes that only murderers have abortion. You know why I mention teens? I'm trying to gain pro-life sympathy. I need pro-life to see the face of the woman they are condemning.


Really? I thought you mentioned teens because they [paraphrase] "are what the stereotype classifies them as".

Quit caring about what I think. Wink


I always have multiple reasons for what I do. And if I don't care what my allies think, then I am lost for sure.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-20-07 23:47pm

Few teen make all the right choices. All the gods know I did not as a teen make all the right choices. I have two daughters, one concieved when I was 19.. I was too dammed young then to have been breeding but I thought it would be ok.
I haven't seen her father in 15 years, nor had a dime of the now 54,000$ in back support owed to me paid. Yes teen make bad choice but you know what? Its all part of learning and growing.
There is no reason to force a teen to start off adulthood early or in a disadvantaged position because she got pregnant.
That is abuse.

That little girl is a teen now, I know for a fact she has almost no chance of becoming pregnant but that doesn't mean she won't make mistakes, when she does we talk about them, see what we can do to correct them and what she learned from them.. same as my mother did for me.

Teens are not perfect.... Thank the Gods. All of Them.
Did you find this post useful?
|
chick1978

Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 08 Apr 2007
Posts: 68
Location: canada

Posted: 04-21-07 00:00am

But aren't you glad you have your wonderful daughter?
You seemed to have coped well with motherhood.




Jincks013 wrote:
Few teen make all the right choices. All the gods know I did not as a teen make all the right choices. I have two daughters, one concieved when I was 19.. I was too dammed young then to have been breeding but I thought it would be ok.
I haven't seen her father in 15 years, nor had a dime of the now 54,000$ in back support owed to me paid. Yes teen make bad choice but you know what? Its all part of learning and growing.
There is no reason to force a teen to start off adulthood early or in a disadvantaged position because she got pregnant.
That is abuse.

That little girl is a teen now, I know for a fact she has almost no chance of becoming pregnant but that doesn't mean she won't make mistakes, when she does we talk about them, see what we can do to correct them and what she learned from them.. same as my mother did for me.

Teens are not perfect.... Thank the Gods. All of Them.
Did you find this post useful?
|
nightangel73

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 2769
Location: ,
Thanks: 19
Thanked:18

Posted: 04-21-07 08:39am

Jincks013 wrote:

There is no reason to force a teen to start off adulthood early or in a disadvantaged position because she got pregnant.
That is abuse.

The girl is not forced to adulthood because nobody forced her to have sex.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-21-07 13:39pm

She wasn't forced to have sex - maybe - but our hypothetical teen was forced to give birth, and that's just as wrong as rape.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Birch

Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4159
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16

Posted: 04-22-07 13:29pm

nightangel73 wrote:


The girl is not forced to adulthood because nobody forced her to have sex.


Does having sex equate to being an adult? Geez, I know alot of fifteen year olds who should be out voting. Wink
Did you find this post useful?
|
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-22-07 15:24pm

Birch wrote:
nightangel73 wrote:


The girl is not forced to adulthood because nobody forced her to have sex.


Does having sex equate to being an adult? Geez, I know alot of fifteen year olds who should be out voting. Wink


I definately know that having sex doesn't make someone an adult.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-23-07 08:46am

Yes Chick, I do thank both my gods for my daughter. That does not mean I will impose my concept of morality on anyone else though.
Personally I do not care if a woman aborts save for it being her choice to do. Only when it is a coerced abortion do I have issues with it.

Its not my job to moderate some other womans body. I know what choices were right for me.
I have one daughter.
I lost a son - still birth.
I aborted the pregnancy afterward.
I tried again and lost it to spontanous abortion aka 2nd trimester miscarriage.
I tried again with the same result.
I finally had the second child I wanted.

Another girl I call my Sunchild for her honey gold hair.
My eldest being my Moonchild for her ravens black locks.

I have never been a terrified as when I had my youngest, who is my pill baby, because the doctor flat told me I have I had a high chance of not surviving the pregnancy. Now mind you this was 1995 and we simply did not have the technology then to have a mid term premie live.
The drug that forces lungs to develope early came out a year after my son died.

Still for all that it is not my job to tell you what to do with your body. I wish more people realized that.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Becky

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 6230
Location: London, England
Thanks: 0
Thanked:7

Posted: 04-23-07 09:45am

i have a daughter who i product of the pill and a son product of the withdrawal method. i concieved my 3rd child in the week i took out my iud as it was giving me problems.

i sometimes think what life would of been like without kids. i see that it would be a lonely life but with lots of freedom. this freedom definately appeals to me but obviously there is not much i can do now as i have my children.

i agree 100% that people who don't want kids should be intitled to a tubal. my husband was supposed to have a vasectomy after our second child was born but they denied him and i had three pregnancies in under 3 years. unfortunately my last child was born premature and passed away but it is still outrageous that they won't give him a vasectomy as he is only 23. i have the mirena coil now and feel pretty safe but now we have split he is terrified of getting his new partner pregnant and i think that's awful for him.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-23-07 10:54am

Eiri wrote:
She wasn't forced to have sex - maybe - but our hypothetical teen was forced to give birth, and that's just as wrong as rape.


Exactly. Thank you Eiri. IMO it is equally a crime to force parenthood on a teenager, particularly in view of the known medical facts that pregnancy is more dangerous for a teenager then an adult.

Why force that on the girl? Why force her to be a parent while she is still a child? Using the 'consent to sex, consent to pregnancy' model does not fly here.
If that were workable we'd be right back to the tired old 'close her legs' arguement and last I heard teens were majorly curious creatures who did not take the time, especially when hormones are raging and they have sexual longings they aren't equipped to fully understand, at taking a step back.
They do it. They have sex. Sometimes a pregnancy results and when it does she has options then. One of those is abortion, she can keep the resultant pregnancy or relinquish.
My goal is to ensure she always has choices.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Birch

Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4159
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16

Posted: 04-23-07 13:05pm

Jincks013 wrote:


Exactly. Thank you Eiri. IMO it is equally a crime to force parenthood on a teenager, particularly in view of the known medical facts that pregnancy is more dangerous for a teenager then an adult.


Not to throw off on a tangent, but how accurate is this? I keep seeing stats that women over 35 have a much higher mortality rate associated with pregnancy. Anyone help me out? Thanks
Did you find this post useful?
|
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-23-07 13:24pm

Birch wrote:
Jincks013 wrote:


Exactly. Thank you Eiri. IMO it is equally a crime to force parenthood on a teenager, particularly in view of the known medical facts that pregnancy is more dangerous for a teenager then an adult.


Not to throw off on a tangent, but how accurate is this? I keep seeing stats that women over 35 have a much higher mortality rate associated with pregnancy. Anyone help me out? Thanks


As with many things, the very young and the very old are both at risk.

Young teens are clearly at risk because their bodies are simply not developed enough; their hips are too thin to give birth. In third world countries, many young women die in child birth - and the baby dies too - because the baby gets stuck.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-23-07 18:01pm

Birch wrote:
Jincks013 wrote:


Exactly. Thank you Eiri. IMO it is equally a crime to force parenthood on a teenager, particularly in view of the known medical facts that pregnancy is more dangerous for a teenager then an adult.


Not to throw off on a tangent, but how accurate is this? I keep seeing stats that women over 35 have a much higher mortality rate associated with pregnancy. Anyone help me out? Thanks


Back click through the links and visit the Teen Pregnancy Forum on this very board.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Birch

Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4159
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16

Posted: 04-23-07 21:01pm

How about websites?

I would think that logically the body starts menstruating because it is ready to carry a child. If the mortality rate is high, could it be that the teen is physically capable of having a child, but does not attain adequate prenatal care (such as nutrition, dr's visits, etc.) and they don't do the 'right' things, such as quit smoking, drinking, etc.?
Did you find this post useful?
|
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-23-07 21:13pm

Birch wrote:
How about websites?

I would think that logically the body starts menstruating because it is ready to carry a child. If the mortality rate is high, could it be that the teen is physically capable of having a child, but does not attain adequate prenatal care (such as nutrition, dr's visits, etc.) and they don't do the 'right' things, such as quit smoking, drinking, etc.?


Logic and the human body do not coincide. Go tell the dead african girls that they "should have been physically ready" to give birth. I don't mean to sound harsh, but surely you can see that a girl who is 12 and has just started menstruating is not physically ready to give birth? I certainly wasn't ready to give birth when I started menstruating.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Birch

Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4159
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16

Posted: 04-23-07 23:35pm

Eiri wrote:
Birch wrote:
How about websites?

I would think that logically the body starts menstruating because it is ready to carry a child. If the mortality rate is high, could it be that the teen is physically capable of having a child, but does not attain adequate prenatal care (such as nutrition, dr's visits, etc.) and they don't do the 'right' things, such as quit smoking, drinking, etc.?


Logic and the human body do not coincide. Go tell the dead african girls that they "should have been physically ready" to give birth. I don't mean to sound harsh, but surely you can see that a girl who is 12 and has just started menstruating is not physically ready to give birth? I certainly wasn't ready to give birth when I started menstruating.


I'm looking for statistics I can comprehensively look at and see if there are outlying reasons why teens are subject to maternal death more than older adults. I am having a hard time finding facts about this. Anecdotes and stereotypes are not what I'm looking for; I already have plenty of those under my belt. Very
Happy

(And none of this is a personal attack towards you in any shape or way. It's just that I can's write a paper or converse intelligently without some kind of statistical information to back it up. Know what I mean?)
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-24-07 00:30am

I'm not going to clutter up the page with large amounts of copy paste but if typing "teenage pregnancy" into your browser does not get you any of the 4,400,000 responses, literally,(( Search Results1 - 10 of about 4,400,000 for teen age pregnancy - 0.27 sec. )) that I got when I typed it into mine this could be a good place to start.

Teen Pregnancy
Did you find this post useful?
|
Tylanas

Especially EHEALTHy
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 12984
Thanks: 3
Thanked:0

Posted: 04-24-07 00:31am

I'll go find information.

For the record, I never said that young teens were more likely to die than older women. I in fact tried to say that the risks are similar, not one larger than another. A fully physically mature adult woman between the ages of 18-30 is most likely to have a healthy child with little complications. Women older and women younger at at a higher risk of complications; that's all I said.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Jincks013

Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
Thanked:13

Posted: 04-24-07 09:08am

Birch wrote:
How about websites?

I would think that logically the body starts menstruating because it is ready to carry a child.?


I started menstruating at 11 myself. I I was 4'ft 6 inches tall, weighed about 60 pounds, and had little a cup breasts. That is not a body ready to bear children.

Bone density is a major issue. Teen pregnancy and bone loss later in life have been linked a great deal. To quote the article "If bone structure is not fully developed, she takes the risk of injuring her spine and pelvic bones".
Just becasue she is ovulating does not mean her body is really ready for pregnancy.

Health Risks to a Teenage mother

A teenage mother has special problems, emotionally and physically

* The death rate from pregnancy complications is a lot higher for girls who are pregnant under the age of 15 than among older teenagers
* Pregnant teenagers are more likely to be undernourished and suffer premature or prolonged labor
* During the first 3 months of pregnancy; seven out of ten teenage girls do not get prenatal care, see a doctor, or go to a clinic
* Teenage mothers are at risk of getting anemia, high blood pressure, placental problems, and pregnancy induced hypertension
* Teenage girls with STI's or HIV can pass complications on to her baby when it is born
* Teenage girls may also develop many emotional problems such as depression, shame, guilt, and stress
* Teenage mothers have the risk of problems such as poor weight gain, premature labor, and other complications. *The younger the mother, the greater the chance to have complications for both the baby and the mother.
Source
Did you find this post useful?
|
Birch

Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4159
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16

Posted: 04-24-07 14:44pm

Jincks013 wrote:
Birch wrote:
How about websites?

I would think that logically the body starts menstruating because it is ready to carry a child.?


I started menstruating at 11 myself. I I was 4'ft 6 inches tall, weighed about 60 pounds, and had little a cup breasts. That is not a body ready to bear children.

Bone density is a major issue. Teen pregnancy and bone loss later in life have been linked a great deal. To quote the article "If bone structure is not fully developed, she takes the risk of injuring her spine and pelvic bones".
Just becasue she is ovulating does not mean her body is really ready for pregnancy.

Health Risks to a Teenage mother

A teenage mother has special problems, emotionally and physically

* The death rate from pregnancy complications is a lot higher for girls who are pregnant under the age of 15 than among older teenagers
* Pregnant teenagers are more likely to be undernourished and suffer premature or prolonged labor
* During the first 3 months of pregnancy; seven out of ten teenage girls do not get prenatal care, see a doctor, or go to a clinic
* Teenage mothers are at risk of getting anemia, high blood pressure, placental problems, and pregnancy induced hypertension
* Teenage girls with STI's or HIV can pass complications on to her baby when it is born
* Teenage girls may also develop many emotional problems such as depression, shame, guilt, and stress
* Teenage mothers have the risk of problems such as poor weight gain, premature labor, and other complications. *The younger the mother, the greater the chance to have complications for both the baby and the mother.
Source


Thank you for the link. Very
Happy I was hoping for more of a "study" kind of thing. I don't like it when I hear "it may" or "risks" without hearing more substantial information. However, the bone density issue makes sense. I also wonder if evolutionary-wise the female body is not "supposed" to be attractive to a male until she has achieved a certain level of development; including full hips and breasts that indicate a readiness for reproduction.

While it does seem clear that there are psychosocial issues that arise when teens have babies, are there other clear biological risks? I guess what I'm asking is that are we encultured to believe that teens are not psychosocially prepared to bear children, yet physical bodies are?

For example, taking from the above, "* During the first 3 months of pregnancy; seven out of ten teenage girls do not get prenatal care, see a doctor, or go to a clinic." While this adds to the risk of teenage pregnancy, if the teen had received prenatal care the risks that follow not having prenatal care would be diminished drastically. That is a social issue, not a biological one. Does that make sense?

Of course there are exceptions to the rule, like yourself and your smaller frame.
Did you find this post useful?
|
Related Topics
This Forum This Category All Forums
Jump to:  
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
New Topic   Reply



Page 3 of 5
We comply with the HONcode standard for trustworthy health
information:
verify here.